Atome (LSE:ATOM) — Investor Presentation

0:02 Good morning, and welcome to the ATOM Energy PLC Investor Presentation. Throughout this recorded presentation, investors will be in listen only mode. Questions are encouraged and can be submitted at any time by the q and a tab situated in the right hand corner of your screen. Just simply type in your questions and press send. The company may not be in a position to answer every question it receives in the meeting itself. However, the company will review all questions submitted today and publish responses where it is appropriate to do so. Before we begin, I'd like to submit the following poll. And I'd now like to hand you over to Olivier Musat, CEO. Good morning to you, sir.

0:33 Yeah. Good morning, Alexander. Thank you very much for having us. So I guess I will start the presentation now. So I think thank you very much, everyone, for coming. The it's clearly a very exciting time at in the company. As most of you would know, we've only listed less than well, 11 unchanged. So we've been busy. We've tried to keep everybody updated as much as possible, and we're obviously sharing a bit more details about the 120 megawatts upsize that we announced just a few days ago. So for those for those of us of you who doesn't who don't know us, ATOM, we are the only pure play company dedicated on the production side of green hydrogen and green ammonia.

1:21 There are a number of companies on the technology side, but up to date, nobody has really looked on the production side, which is where we need to go when it comes to energy and food security. So when we listed, we got the Green Energy Mark, a member of the UK Hydrogen Association, and very importantly, the International Fertilizer Association because we will be producing ammonia, you know, via hydrogen. So it is mostly used as a fertilizer as I will get into shortly. So I will go through the usual disclaimers. But what what are we? You know? How different are we? The idea for us is is to be nimble. You know? We are able to move projects at scale.

2:07 If you have to put in context today, there's only about 550 megawatts of electrolysis in operation. So whilst we absolutely need to go towards the gigawatt scale, the reality is if we want to deliver things between now and 2030, the only way to do it is in 1,000 megawatts increments and get into that market very quickly. This is where you have the highest competitive edge. As you have heard a lot, there's been a lot of questions around the cost of hydrogen. And and the reality is 70% of the cost of hydrogen is dependent on the cost of electricity, on the amount of infrastructure that need to put together, which is why as a business case, we have chosen to partner with electricity generators.

2:52 And first and foremost, Paraguay's Ande, the utility energy utility in Paraguay. Originally, we were looking at a 50 megawatt project, then we looked at 60 megawatt, which is the PPA that we signed, and we actually increased it to a 120 megawatt, and I'll go a little bit into the detail. We have now started a front end engineering and design, having appointed just last week our engineers. And some of you may remember a few weeks ago, we have also appointed ATOME PLC investment bank to put the project together. So a 120 megawatt, what does it mean? It's about a 100,000 tons of ammonia per year. It is really world scale. You know, it will be the largest production facility in production in 2025 on all of the Latin Latin American continent.

3:44 So it's all about growing fast. It is very important. We are nimble. It allows us to go fast, but also this is where you can establish and get market share and scale up from that. Clearly, looking into ammonia and agriculture, hydrogen is important, is great, is the future, but the present is agriculture. And on the clean fuel side, we have a a smaller unit called ATOMobility, which is dedicated towards, you know, heavy roads and shipping transport. So as a quick reminder, so when ATOM was created, we were looking at Paraguay and Iceland. So Paraguay has definitely accelerated now. And if you look on the top left, you see that we have appointed our owners engineers, ATOM, our financial adviser.

4:29 We have signed the power supply. We have signed the feed contractor, and we are now finalizing on the market study side and on the environment and social side. So how we progressed since the IPO from twelve months ago, almost, it really gives you a sense that we were originally looking at about 250 megawatts of potential in Paraguay alone. Now we're looking at about 420 megawatt, of which a 120 is completely secured by now. So we've increased significantly that side of the business. We then created the mobility unit that I will discuss a little bit later. And and we're also in discussions on the Intaipu, Iguazu side of 300 megawatt.

5:15 We have also bought the land. We have expanded the team. So we continue to make real progress and also building the pipeline for the future of ATOM as we continue to, again, go faster than than the large companies and in order to get market share early. So the team who you may remember, I'll I'll I'll just, you know, remind you very briefly. Peter is our chairman and major shareholder who has an experience in creating and exiting energy companies and has really a keen keen eye on costs. When it it comes also to myself, where I started as an engineer in the power sector, then moved to the oil and gas sector, and then on the investment side. Right? The both on the debt side when I was with Suncharted and then moved to the World Bank and the International Finance Corporation, where in my last job, I was the chief investment officer of the debt and equity global energy portfolio.

6:13 Jim Spaulding, extremely importantly in Paraguay, is the team that we have been building in Paraguay who used to run the hydroelectric dam and who really understands what are what needs to be done, what is the political economy, what is the regulatory economy, and and does everything he can do to actually fast track the project. And, of course, my rose, our sign on exec who used to be the general manager for the IES hydrogen partnership and who has, you know, more than 15 experience just on the hydrogen side. So ATOM, you know, we talk about energy security. We talk about food security. Clearly, now it's, you know, it's more important than ever. Last year, we we knew that we were going into an energy crunch, but I think I think it's for a fact that really we have seen how how Ukraine has really accelerated the thesis that we were working in systems where you had under investments in oil and gas, and we were increasingly dependent on very few large suppliers.

7:15 And you only need one of these suppliers to get into trouble for entire energy chain. So we are now moving into a play where thanks to lowering cost in in renewable energy over time, we are able increasingly to produce hydrogen cheaper and therefore ammonia cheaper. And we are seeing that it's it's about changing the system, being very early on into that whole equation and being the first entrant in a place which can pretty much displace about 20% of our oil and gas uses today. So 20% of the global oil production. If you think that today, have about a 100,000,000 barrels a day of oil production, multiply that by about $90 a barrel using a little bit of a of a wide average over the past few months. It gives you a sense of the size of the price that you can address with molecules, with green hydrogen, green ammonia, which is why we are saying it is the molecule of the future because this is going to be increasingly a wider and wider traded commodity as it is able to address shipping, trucking, pipeline, power supply, and soon enough airlines, and clearly also power generation.

8:34 And obviously, from the ammonia opportunity, again, hydrogen is coming. It's coming fast, but not as fast as people would like to think whilst ammonia is really the market today. So just on the technical side of you point of view, if you remember, the way that we make green hydrogen is you take water, which is h two o, then you take what is pretty much an electrolyzer, which is pretty much an electrical hammer where for a lot of current going through the electrolyzer, it splits the molecule of water h and o, so hydrogen, oxygen. And then after that, what you do is that you have a direct air capture unit, which strips from the air the nitrogen. Nitrogen is more than 70% of the composition of the air that we breathe. And and essentially puts together that hydrogen molecule, that nitrogen molecule to create h n three, which is ammonia.

9:32 And the reason we say it's green is because we use green electricity to create a green molecule. Green electron becomes a green molecule. But today, what we have had up until today is 99% of all ammonia produced is derived from natural gas, from coal, from hydrocarbons. So it has been increasingly subject to the variability of hydrocarbon prices. And on the electricity side, with the cost of electricity lowering globally, you've had more and more opportunities to to create to expand electrolyzer capacity, to reduce the cost of electrolyzer, and also on the renewable power side as the cost of solar has declined by over 90% over the past fifteen years. The cost of electricity and excess electricity has become cheap enough.

10:20 So suddenly, you are in a position where you can produce green molecules for cheaper than the gray slash hydrocarbon molecules. And this is really where the world has been changing and changing very fast, and Ukraine has only accelerated that. And what I mean by that is that today, 30% of all fertilizers are made between Russia, Ukraine, and Belarus. Right? We have today we're talking about gas. We're talking about oil, but we are really forgetting a lot about the fertilizer price, which is affecting food price and has a much longer effect. So today, if you have cheap electricity, you can produce cheap ammonia and selling into a market, which today is about more than two times more expensive than when we listed two years ago. So, actually, the price of ammonia peaked at about $1,600 a ton back in q two this year.

11:14 Now it has stabilized at around $1,000 a ton. So when it comes to our project so the picture that you have here is a picture of Itaiputa. So the way that ATOM looked at things and in our strategy is really to leverage existing infrastructure, existing power supply, existing demand centers so that we really only have to focus on building only the electrolyzer, only the the compressors, and then the ammonia loop facility, and, of course, the storage and leverage existing power supply, existing transmission line, existing port facilities, existing markets. There are a number of other projects globally that you are hearing about, but most of these, and if not all of them, are actually having to build their own source of power. They have to build their own transmission line. They have to build their own port facilities.

12:11 So very quickly, you get into risk on risk on risk of projects, which become a lot more expensive and and take a lot longer to be able to put together. Whilst in Paraguay, you have excess electricity available twenty four seven, which allows you to use the lowest technology of the most mature technology when it comes to electrolyzers and leverage on all of these elements of infrastructure I was talking about earlier. So Paraguay itself, and I was asked a question recently on the CNBC interview, and it shows you how we couldn't have to continue to educate the market. Paraguay, it's a double b plus country. It's possibly one of the most politically stable country in all of Latin America.

12:56 It's it's had, you know, obviously, very difficult dictatorship about forty years ago. But ever since then, it's been a very stable country with a very low unemployment rate, low taxation rate, and presidents can only do one term. So that stability allows you to invest on the long term. Also, it has invested very early on on its power supply. Right? The the Itaipu Dam, which is the second largest hydro dam in the world, started building forty years ago and has been in production for thirty years ago. And yet, Paraguay only uses about 30%, three zero, of its net of its net production of electricity and has been selling it to Brazil since. So the country now sees the opportunity to continue to use domestic electrons and create domestic molecules that it can sell at a vast premium over what is selling electricity at at the moment.

13:55 And the market is huge, much fee, when it comes to the demand for fertilizer between Paraguay and Brazil and the Mercosur region, it is the largest importer of fertilizers today. So it is really feeling, you know, the the pinch that that we are seeing globally at at a much broader scale. So the project itself, in here in this map, you you will be able to find this this presentation on our website. It shows you how our first first site of the data. If you look at this the Red Square is the land that we bought, so the 75 acres of land. It is a lot bigger than what we need. You know, we we need barely about 10 acres of land, but it just shows it allows us to scale up from this land. And it we've chosen this site because it is right across the Andes Substation.

14:48 So that's a 120 megawatt substation. Originally, we had a 60 megawatt allocation, But when we realized that actually the demand of power in in from that substation wasn't coming, we made the request to Andy to upsize our our power supply, which after about three months of electro electromechanical studies, and we were able to prove to Andy that us taking the full load from that substation will not create any issues on the grid or on the technical side of the utility. They allow us to do and then expanded our power supply for a 120 megawatt. So I was mentioning from a location point of view, I think you can't really see the scale very well here, but the nearest ports to us and the access to water is about two kilometers. And then you have four different large industrial clusters, which are the ports where today all of the fertilizers into Paraguay are imported from the Paraguay to Parana River, which goes to the Atlantic.

15:52 And on this river, you have it is also the place from where you export all of the soybean, all of the meat products, and some of the iron ore that is that is produced in Brazil. So it's a place where you have about 3,000 barges at all time navigating up and down what is, you know, essentially a massive river. I think if you wanna get an idea of scale of how much water is flowing for this river, it's estimated that about one Olympic pool a second is flowing through. It is really it it is really something to see. So at at a 120 megawatts, it allows us to build a 100 and a 100,000 ton per year ammonia production facility.

16:37 And that's quite important because a 100,000 ton, as we were progressing all of our technical work, we realized that whilst economies of scale to go from 60 to a 120 megawatt on the hydrogen side, on the electrolyzer side is not really there. It's pretty much straight line. You have much better economies of scale of going from fifty, fifty five thousand ton to a 100,000 ton on the ammonia. So on the chemistry, on the heat, on the way you build the facility, you would actually have a significant savings on a per unit basis. You may have also noticed that we signed an MOU with Puma Energy on relations to hydrogen in Paraguay. We will obviously producing mostly ammonia, but as we're thinking about the future of the future of the market for hydrogen, it allows us to be in a very strong position in the country, which obviously uses about a million dollars of diesel a billion dollars, sorry, of diesel a year.

17:37 So for the next step, you know, we are starting the the front end engineer and design stage. We are obviously talking through net access to a number of green infrastructure funds, specialist specialist fund, specialist development finance institution like the IFC, like the IDB to prepare everything so that we are ready for final investment decision by q two two thousand and twenty three, which then would allow us to be in production by 2025.

18:14 And then on the the other side and where is the next growth opportunity for us, it is really Iguazu Itaipu. So this is the Itaipu Dam. So, obviously, in Vieita, we get our power from Itaipu. But closer to the dam, there is there are a number of substation which are being built today by Ande. So we are currently negotiating a power allocation at the same industrial price from Ande so that we can do our second project in in Itaipu. And the intention for us is to leverage what we will be learning from the ATOM, from that 120 megawatt facility, and then copy paste and scale up. So a 120 megawatt and plus possibly another 180 megawatt, again, to think about speed and how we can continue developing at pace as we want to continue, you know, having the leadership whilst other people are still doing studies we would actually be doing.

19:10 On the ATOM mobility side, so this is what we announced, I want to say, about nine months ago. When we were discussing with the government and realized that they had the most forward electromobility legislation in all of Latin America, they were one of the first one to import electric buses. We saw the opportunity that we could actually look at hydrogen as a fuel for trucks. And it is, you know, equally a demonstration project as it is also a very strong domestic marketing project. So whilst if you're looking at a very large ammonia export facility, the people don't really see it. However, the moment you have ATOM fuels hydrogen fueling station, you know, ATOM trucks, ATOM cars going around the city. It's really about increasing our buying and our presence in the country and through the Puma network, which is one of the largest fuel station network in the country.

20:11 As this economy scales up, it gets you it gets you really an early entry and a great option to grow into the mobility sector as it gets proven. And, obviously, you can produce hydrogen domestically cheaper than you have than you can import diesel. So there's really a market opportunity there to displace expensive imports and use domestic green resources. So the next project that we have been discussing since day one has been Iceland, which is looking at up to a 100 and megawatt capacity. So this is one of the sites of that was identified, which is the site. Over here on the on the map, what you see in white, it's a poly polysilicon export facility with the intention originally to build next to it green hydrogen to green ammonia facility using existing geothermal power.

21:08 So we were expecting when we listed to reach FID or FEED by q three, q four this year, but Iceland itself has not been immune from the issues of power in Europe. So things have indeed slowed down a little bit more than what we were expected as the country looked at places like Germany and others and how unprepared they were for macroeconomic shocks and has really decided to take a step back, look at all of the power metrics of the country, and really help redefine what they were going to do over the next ten years. It's a country which hadn't invested into any new power supply since 2013. And what we have done since is talk to all of the power suppliers between Hans Verken, ON, HS Orka, and some of the private to get a sense of where would be the best energy mix that we could get to progress our first project. So we are still very much on the development phase. It is going slower than what we expected indeed.

22:12 But, clearly, for us, what we saw, what was really interesting in Iceland, it's green electricity. It is close to Europe, which is a premium market, but also the next stage of growth was going to be around the shipping fuel side. You know, Iceland has green commitments clearly, and its largest pan of economy is the shipping and fishing sector. So as we are seeing green ammonia developing very quickly as a very viable fuel for shipping, it might very well be that when we are ready to go into a PPA and a feed stage, the production will focus more on the shipping's domestic shipping side in order to displace HFO imports.

22:58 This shows you the discussions that we have been having so far about the discussion at the ministry level, you know, with with various technical suppliers, with various off takers in Europe, in including some of the shipping companies in in the country as well. And and I think as an expression that the government really didn't, you know, didn't want to think that they were, let's say, play the clock. Actually, they provided the greenfield team with a grant of about a £175,000 to dollars to show that they were committed to the green economy and to the green fuel ATOM project.

23:37 I think that we discussed scaling up in Paraguay earlier, but we are looking at other projects. One of the big drive that we had when we listed was that we fought and and and we saw it coming through. That by being listed, it gives us a lot more options and also a bigger presence and a earlier recognition so that other companies, other developers who have been trying to put to get projects off the ground would naturally come to us as they would be increasingly struggling struggling as the markets dried up. And, really, I mean, you may have seen that I think the IPO market was really tough this year, and we know of a couple of players who did try to IPO and who couldn't get it. So when we look at any new opportunities, and we're looking at a few in LatAm, in The Middle East, and as well as in Southern Europe, it's really about, number one, having the right partners on the ground. Right? We we are a 100% in in Paraguay because we've had a long experience of of on the ground. But if we're gonna go into a new geography, if we want to go faster, we need to find the right partners.

24:43 The next side is having the right infrastructure so so that we don't have to invest in that existing infrastructure in into more infrastructure, which will then take more time, which will increase CapEx. And also the strong local demand. You know, we really want to make sure that first port of call is you are able to produce domestically cheap cheaper than what you can import, then you scale up, and then you start exporting as you have leveraged a lot of the existing demand and the existing infrastructure. So here are some of the timelines that you are seeing of what we have achieved so far since the IPO. So clearly, Vieta has been going a lot faster and bigger than what we even expected in in our most, I guess, world's dream.

25:32 You see what where mobility is, where we created the division, ordered our first electrolyzer for CPH two, and expect first revenue in 2023. And and then expanding this, and when we look at ITAIPO, the intention is to get into a position to to sign a power purchase agreement in 2023, hopefully, in the first half of twenty twenty three. And when it comes to Iceland, you know, the idea and the intention is to get to a power purchase agreement by by the end of the first half or early second half of twenty twenty three and then move forward. And, obviously, in this one, you don't really see the other opportunities that we've been looking at. We are certainly pushing very hard, and, hopefully, we'll be able to announce something in the coming months. But, clearly, today, we have to deliver VETA. It is really the big price, which we'll learn from the most, and then we can grow and replicate what we are learning in VETA in every single new project.

26:34 And I think that's it for the presentation. Oh, yes. On the appendix side, if you wanted to have a sense of who we appointed as the front end contractors, we really we really chose a group of contractors who could move very seamlessly towards EPC. And have been leading contractors building energy and infrastructure facilities in LatAm. And if you look at TSK, they have a lot of experience in Europe being involved in all of the major hydrogen, how do you call them, initiatives in Spain and Europe. And very importantly, Gasale, which is the leading engineer for the development of ammonia plants with over a hundred years of experience. So if you want to be able to produce, you know, on spec quickly and cheaply, having Casale as part of the engineering team is very important.

27:35 So that's it for the presentation, and we can move to the q and a. Olivia, thanks very much for your presentation. And ladies and gentlemen, please do continue to submit your questions just using the q and a tab, which is situated on the top right hand corner of your screen. But just while Olivia takes a few moments to review those questions from today, I'd like to remind you that a recording of this presentation along with a copy of the slides and the published q and a can be accessed via your investor dashboard. Olivia, as you can see, we received a number of questions throughout today's presentation. If I could just ask you to read out those questions and give responses where it's appropriate to do so, I'll pick up from you at the end, and I'll just bring the slides back up for you now. Yep. Thank you. Yeah. I'm trying to find the q and a site now because I can see the slides. I cannot see the q and a. So, Olivia, if you just hover over the slides in the top right, you should be able to come out full screen, and then the q and a should be down your right hand side.

28:29 Sorry, everyone. I think I'm struggling a little bit on this one. Nope. I'm over here now. There might be a button in the bottom right saying chat, a blue button. Yeah. Yeah. Okay. Yeah. Chat. Sorry about that. Yeah. Okay. So I think the the first question is really on c p h two. So the you know, having announced that they've had production delays and and Octopus. So and the Octopus cancellation. So indeed, you know, we have had a number of discussion, and actually, we have weekly call with CPH too. So when the when the Octopus delay and win cancellation was announced, we did ask, and we, you know, we also know people in Octopus, we did ask them as well. So it was very clear that the time frame that Octopus had was much shorter than ours. So Octopus had no choice but to very quickly purchase another electrolyzer, and they couldn't wait, for CPH, to go through all of the safety testing that needed to be gone through.

29:34 So we don't have that, impetus of time. Right? So in our last discussion with CPH, you know, they say, well, we we are able to deliver in q three. So, yes, we were originally thinking we were going to have it by the end of March. That time line has moved and sorry. That time line has moved. And now this is why we are saying in our communication that it's going to be h two start. And and also it's a question of trust but verify. And we did go actually, I was last Monday, I went to C P H 2. I went to visit the unit. It is mostly built, so everything is there. And it's just for them really a question of going for all of the testing. But as, you know, as we've said since day one, I think we wanted to go with CPH too because it's it's another Yorkshire company based in Doncaster, and and we think it's important, you know, as a British company to buy as much British as we can.

30:34 But, nonetheless, exactly like Octopus, if we if we were to see more delay, we have already identified other electrolyzers that we can that we could buy in in a very short time frame to come in and allow us to get into the into an h two startup. But we have a really good relationship with CPH two, and we really appreciate their transparency and what they're trying to do.

31:04 Then there was another question. If you say you will use alkaline electrolyzers. So if you remember, because we have a baseload power, we are able to use bog standard alkaline electrolysis. Right? And and our and our idea for the Vieta project, which in the end where 99.99% of all short term cash flow will come from and large large the large value of ATOM, we will use proven alkaline electrolyzer that we can have at scale. Right? So we have already discussed with all of the major electrolyzer producers the quite advantage that we have in today's environment where you will have seen a number of projects have slowed down in Europe because of a very high cost of power.

31:55 The industrial price that we are able to get in Paraguay is the lowest of all of LATAM. And if not, you know, obviously, compared to Europe, it is much, much lower. So because we will be able to make orders for electrolyzers in 2023, we are actually in a very good position to order a large amount of electrolyzers, alkaline electrolyzers that can be delivered without any issue from 2024. So if I go to the next one from Chris, it will be some time before you're making a profit and your cash position is such that you will need to raise more capital sometime in the next two year. What are our plans?

32:40 So I think we are exactly doing what we said we would do, which is when it comes to funding on the project basis, each project will have its own SPV. And exactly like what you have seen in oil and gas or in wheat farms, it's all about getting the project to FID. And at that particular point, you have created a lot of value into a project, and this is when you get infrastructure funds, green funds, SDG funds, or just regular investors, regular lenders to come in into the project and finance the project at the project level. And that can be done in a mix of ways. So there's one way where you could get actually a a sustainable development fund to fund a 100% of a project on a project finance basis.

33:32 There are other ways when you look at a mix of project finance and also equity investment at the project level from partners, like some of these green investment funds, like also energy companies who would come in and then carry the cost and and the the cost not only of their side of a project, but also ATOM's side of a project. So the it is, you know, the regular structuring that you do in any renewable energy funding, and this is also where we are in a really good place because we are able to go faster. You have heard now that, you know, inflation has crept back in. The cost of interest rate has gone back in. So projects which can be delivered faster will have a much lower cost of funding than those who come in two, three, four years time every single year of delay can erode further the revenue and, sorry, the the IRR of the project, especially as the funding cost comes up. So, again, we are in a really good position, and we are sticking to our strategy that each project will have its own SPV, and we'll be able to leverage the SPV.

34:37 And it's also why we hire hire in the Texas as our, you know, financial adviser. The reason we hire in the Texas after a a beauty contest amongst three three banks, one American, two French, and Netexis, one in Vienna. It's because Netexis was involved in the first two financing of hydrogen projects, one in French Guiana and one in Saudi Arabia, and also have done a number of IPOs in of hydrogen companies in Europe. So they really know the investor mix very well. They know which investor is really interested in some projects. So what is their timeline for investment and what you realize is and it's also one of the reason that I moved from the, let's say, the finance side, the equity side into the ATOM side, is that you have a huge amount of money available for the right project. You just don't have that many projects. So to put it in perspective, about $700,000,000,000 of sustainable funds were raised over the past eighteen months, and maybe 10% of that has actually found a home so far.

35:43 So So can you comment on the commercial terms of a PPA with Ande, the duration, fixed versus variable prices? So I think on on on the on the financial term, it's pretty much it's Visa ten year renewable PPAs using the the industrial price of Andes. So if you look hard enough, you will find them. We tend to be, you know, not we are we are relatively discreet about them because they are they are quite competitive, but they're also published. So it is on a fixed price basis on a long term basis, which creates a lot of stability from our point of view. And as I say, it is on the much lower end of of what you are seeing in Latin America. So if you want all of the details, you're more than welcome to look at the the all of the everything which was published, you know, whether it's by Longspur, by FinCap, Liberum, or SP, and you look in their financial model of the price assumptions.

36:46 Then we have what drives location with the key countries. Is it better to locate at the source of power or what the ammonia domain location? So it it's a mix of things, and I think the the the question is is quite good, and it shows it it shows kind of the knowledge that that that Nick has where the grid side is extremely important. Right? We are at a 120 megawatts. You are a very large user. And and many times, there will be question as if you can grow, are you going to end up in projects where you will create instability of the grid? So there are no real there are no good answer in this one. There are places we've looked at where the grid was very strong, but then it was in a location which wasn't close enough to the market and sometime vice versa.

37:36 So what you what what we look at and and the type of discussion that we have chosen to have is is to really work with the utilities to make sure that what we are doing in our project is not going to strain the grid or require extra investment, which typically needs to go through higher authority approvals, which then take quite a certain amount of time. Again, as I said, speed is very important for us, and making sure that we work in coordination with our power suppliers is also important. On then on the demand side, you know, whether do we want to be close to the ammonia demand location, Think it all depends on the size. And we've spent a lot of time, and actually, we have hired an internal ammonia specialist as well who has significant experience over decades on ammonia.

38:33 Every place is different. Right? So as I mentioned earlier, when it looks at Iceland, you have both. You can ship ammonia into Europe very quickly. You can actually, in the medium term, use it into the shipping fleet. And if you look at some place like Paraguay, you have domestic demand, but then you have the wider demand, and you have two options. You can actually ship it on barges through the Paraguay, Parana River, or you could also truck it truck the ammonia into some of the fertilizer mixes, which have to import at a very high premium. So it's you know, the answer that I'm giving is it depends. But, clearly, it's all about finding this right mix where speed and cost are paramount to everything we do.

39:22 Would further expansion at VFR require grid investment? Well, no. Not at the moment. We at a 120 megawatt, it's a brand new substation, so we are very comfortable there. You could look into places where we could actually decide to generate our own power as well by adding, you know, solar, for example. So there are a number of options that we can look. But, you know, substations are very expensive in general. So we're already maxing out at the moment on the ViaSat substation, which is why when we look at the next growth opportunity for us, it's really going to be. Nick has another question. Does Paraguay have any ambition as an exporter, or is this entirely a domestic play?

40:11 So we do have ambitions as an exporter. The question is which export market do we want to hit? So at a 100,000 ton a year, we are already you know, this is significant. This is something you can actually ship out all the way out into Asia or into Germany. I think we sent an RNS reach two weeks ago after the president of Paraguay and forgot if it was the president of Germany or the chief of the anyways, sorry. Talking about a partnership to be able to import green ammonia from Paraguay, the same way that Chile is looking to export green ammonia into Germany, and it has to go all across, right, for the LATAM. So all of the options are on the table, but clearly for us, it is what other markets we can hit which will give us the biggest premium first.

41:04 And then on top of that, we can give us a green premium, on top of what we are doing. So, clearly, the ambition is to grow is to grow and look at where can we get the best value for the products that we will be producing. Question from Adam. How the jigseries stand out as attractive for ATOM to expand into? Who will be our electrolyzer suppliers? Can we do methanol as well as ammonia? So I think it's we have a little bit of everything in here, so I might not have the time to answer to everything. So I think from geographies, I I explained a little bit earlier where we still think we have a lot of room to expand into, Latin America. We think that places like Egypt, like Morocco are very interesting, but also they are, you know, they're getting quite busy. There are some pockets here or there that we can really find our niche to go faster and cheaper than our competition.

42:00 So when it comes to how do we compare to the current market prices, you know, we can be it depends on the market price, but today, we are confident that we can produce at nearly half of the price, and if not a little lower than half of the price of what you have to import ammonia at in places like like Brazil, for example. Can can we do methanol as well as ammonia? Yes. You could. But when it comes to methanol, when it comes to urea, for example, you you need to have carbon and a stable source of carbon and a very cheap source of carbon. Right? So whilst methanol is interesting, it's still it's not a green molecule as such when you use it. It's also more expensive to produce. Well, yes, you can sell it for more. But if if it costs you more to use carbon to capture the carbon, this is not really a good commercial proposition. So we are always looking at can we get more value out of the ammonia, whether it's going to ammonium nitrate, ammonium phosphate, ammonium sulfates, or urea.

43:05 But as of today, we still think that ammonia, regular ammonia, is going to be the or an an anhydrous ammonia, I should say, is is the best play for us in this in this short term. So as far as, you know, other catalysts in the next six to twelve months, I think we will we will make some of the projects announcement as we continue and we announce how we go about our projects in a very methodical, like an infrastructure investor, like a large energy company does. And we'll continue to be very transparent about every single step with the most important one in q two when we get to final investment decision where we will present, you know, what is our full off taker plan, what is our full financing plan, what is the full technical plan, and how we're move towards EPC.

43:58 So commenting on the shareholder place, how much management and the board own, retail, institutional mix. So on the shareholder base, I think both Peter and I put our own money at the inception of the company, and we continue to support the company. Clearly, I think it's it's very important for the management and also the board to be very incentivized. This is not this is absolutely not a free ride for anyone. I would also say that from a management point of view, what we have asked from everybody who works in the company is to look at what was their previous salary and to take about a 30% salary cut on that, again, to have to really have everybody completely focused. Then our next largest shareholder is Schroders.

44:47 We also have Trafigura. We have Mishinoko. We have West Yorkshire pension plan pension fund. Sorry. So we have a relatively good mix of institutional and, obviously, a lot of retail investors. You know, we we recognize that it's it's still an early story for a number of funds, but we are always upgrading our discussions. And and this is why we are able to see and we get more recognition over time, and we have very, very proactive discussions into educating investors into this new industry. Olivia, if if I may just jump in. I think you've actually addressed all the questions you can from investors. And, of course, the company will review all the questions submitted today, and we'll publish those responses on the Investor Meet company platform.

45:39 But just before redirecting investors, provide you with their feedback, which I know is particularly important to yourself and the company. Olivier, could I just ask you for a few closing remarks? So I think the the the main thing is we, you know, we've we've we've done more than what we set out to do when we listed less than twelve months ago in and facing major headwinds. So, clearly, the it's it's been a very tough moment for a number of players in the market, and that actually has played to our advantage. Clearly, nobody nobody expected us, and we certainly did expect that the hydrogen economy will go so much faster than what it has. And I didn't mention about COP twenty seven, but when you think about more than $500,000,000,000 of funds now in The US dedicated into pushing green hydrogen, more than €300,000,000,000 in Europe. It's an economy which has really taken off, and and we are still the early entrant and the only way for investors to have exposure to that. So we will continue to do everything we can to not disappoint our shareholders of which we have the majority of, and we have our personal, you know, personal, I guess, wealth and and reputation at stake. So we, you know, we want to thank all of our shareholders for their support, and we will continue, to to reward them by delivering more than what we promise.

47:11 Olivia, thanks once again for updating investors today. Could I please ask investors not to close this session as you'll now be automatically redirected to provide your feedback in order that the management team can better understand your views and expectations? This will only take a few moments to complete, which I'm sure will be greatly valued by the company. On behalf of the management team of ATOM Energy PLC, we'd like to thank you for attending today's presentation, and good afternoon to you all.