Quadrise (LSE:QED) — Investor Presentation

0:01 Good afternoon, and welcome to the QUADRISE investor presentation. Just simply type in your question and press send. Due to the number of attendees on today's presentation, the company is not going to be in a position to answer every question received during the meeting itself. Have a review of questions submitted today and publish responses where appropriate to do so. Before we begin, I'd like to submit the following poll. I'd now like to hand you over to the QUADRISE team. Good afternoon. Good afternoon, everyone. Thanks so much for joining us today. I'm Andy Morrison, the Non Executive Chair of QUADRISE, as many of you I hope will know. And I'm joined by Peter Borup, the Chief Executive and David Scott, the Chief Financial Officer. Jason Miles is often on these calls. He's traveling today, so he sends his apologies. But hopefully, we'll be able to address your questions and also explain the transaction that we're currently involved in.

1:03 The transaction that you've seen announced is that we've recently made a placing of £1,200,000 at a penny a share, that's our nominal value, to cover our costs until the middle of next year. The reason we're on this call now is to invite retail shareholders to participate in a retail offer alongside that. In fact, from our point of view, it's the existing shareholders that we really want to get involved in this place in which we recognize as being at a low price level. So it's an opportunity really for you guys to understand from us what it is that's brought us to this point, and what we're looking forward to in the future. And then you can make a decision as to whether you want wish to participate or not in the retail offer.

1:52 And we've received a lot of questions in advance, as you might imagine. I would say more than 50% of those are related to half a dozen recurring questions that people want answers to, and understandably want answers to. So, what we've decided to do is to address those six questions upfront, and then we will have Peter make a presentation, and then we'll come back to some of the remaining questions, and the ones that we've already had pre submitted, and also the ones that are submitted during the course of the event afternoon. So, that, I hand over to David. Thanks, Andy. So, the first question we've got is: Why are we raising funds now?

2:40 Yeah, and I think that's a really good question, and we hit it straight on. So, fundamentally, it's about giving the management the tools to succeed. We want this business to work, and we need to have management with the tools that they need. Absolutely, clearly, it's taken us longer than we anticipated when we raised money last time in early twenty twenty five. And it's taken us longer than Peter intended when he joined in October as well. So we recognise that it's taken longer. But are we confident that we're on the right path? Absolutely, yes. Are we sitting on specific RNessable information? Of course not. If we did, then we would have sent it out already.

3:26 So, we need to give Peter the tools to give him the confidence to push forward with the and the team push forward with the commercialization of business. And then if you think about it, one of the alternatives that as a board we are faced with in this situation is well, one is we just keep running, and we hit the milestones, and maybe the price goes up, and maybe we are able to raise money at higher price. And that was something that we were actively considering. But it does run the risk that if we don't get what we want, in terms of milestones and the timeframe, that we run ourselves into a brick wall. And we really don't want to do that. And the further alternative is that we have to start dismantling the capabilities that we know we need to succeed and that we've been putting in place since Peter arrived or during the course of the period. So it was a difficult choice whether to go now or not. But on balance, we felt that going now was the right decision. And it strengthens the balance sheet, looking at our counterparties, they're looking at us. Is QUADRISE somebody that they can rely on to execute?

4:41 And we felt that now is the right time to make that move and to give shareholders the chance to participate to the maximum extent possible. We have, in that process, also been doing what we've called self help. We've been looking very carefully at the cost structures as we always do, but with a renewed focus for this fundraising, knowing how painful it is to have to make this fundraise at such a low price. So we have looked at things like marketing expenses, business development expenses, things that we can do without cutting into the capabilities that we know we need to succeed. So that's the reason for the fundraise right now. Thanks, Andy. So the second question is for you, Peter.

5:27 That is just to give an overview of the current market environment and its impact on QUADRISE. So we are, of course, all aware that the IMO did not make a decision last year on adopting the new rules that would secure a global level playing field for shipping. It was suspended for a year. Nothing much has I mean, a lot has happened, but no decision is closed. It's pretty clear that there are two games to play, one where the American administration is looking to disrupt the international collaborative order, if you will, and another one where many of the traditional players at the IMO are looking to find a new balance in this and maybe change some of the requirements.

6:13 Everything we hear is that it's going to take longer. There's some faith in this happening. I know the European Union is facing a situation where some of the member countries did not vote altogether last year and where some of the member countries have also made new proposals going back to the previous position. There's a lot of confidence in Brussels that as a new majority falls behind a new consensus that everybody will come along. So I think it will happen, but it's not gonna happen this year. Related to this, if you will, the uncertainty in this space, we have a war in The Middle East again. We have a lot of our clients who have ships caught behind the Strait Of Hormuz. Fortunately, a lot of them managed to get them out over the recent couple of weeks.

7:00 And that's, of course, the main priority. You I cannot I cannot express how bad it is to have seafarers caught behind in a conflict, and you need to address the families and you need to get them out. You get you need to get the ships out. That seems to have become a lot less stressful now. But you still have a situation where fuel is a scarce resource. Fuel related products like lube oils is also a scarce resource. So many of the people that we normally will sell to or talk to are under enormous pressure now to deliver and to be a little bit ahead of everybody else. We also see it in some of the businesses that we are also selling to. OCP in Morocco, a fertilizer company, the biggest in the world, needs sulfur. And traditionally, they've gotten that sulfur from the Persian Gulf. So they're also in a situation where their supply lines are under a lot of stress and a lot of uncertainty.

7:56 Overall, the world is dominated by uncertainty at the moment, it's not just about wars. It's also about geopolitics, how alliances are being strained and are being redefined, whether it is in trade and in supply chains or whether it's military alliances, but also a world where the technologies that we are seeing are exponential. And it's not just AI, it's a number of other ones. So a prudent executive will look at this and make sure that he shrinks his balance sheet, that he cuts costs wherever they can. So another another way of expressing the question I'm trying to answer now is, is the speed transition over? And I don't think so. I think it's still there. Most of the companies we talk to still genuinely wanna do something good, but they all have to make sure that they're be around for it. So they will look for cheap alternatives.

8:45 And so I think from a marketing perspective, there is a time lag, but I think that the the IMSA product is strong and offers some of the savings that people are looking for. And it offers a longer runway actually on the fuel because under the same conditions, we actually utilize up to 9% more of the inherent energy in the same volume on fuel. Thanks, Peter. So the next one is for you, Andy. And it's what is different this time? Yeah. That's another very good question, and it was repeated many times by investors. The and I would preface this by saying that the business question that QUADRISE is trying to solve now has never been an easy one to solve. And then many of you shareholders will have been around involved in the company longer than I have, and I've seen us attempt to solve that problem over many, many years. So there's never been an easy question.

9:44 There's a reason for that. It's really because we're dealing with counterparties that have much longer time scales ship owners, refineries, have much bigger organizations than us, and they're taking generational decisions. And that's somehow difficult to square sometimes with a small cap company on a retail market such as AIM. So there's always been a difficult question to resolve. And I think when we looked at it beginning of last year when we had the fundraise, which was we raised over £6,000,000, we could see as a board that the main issue that we had was management bandwidth. And that's both in quantity, being able to address all the different parts of the question that were being faced, And also in terms of the the range of capabilities that are needed to succeed. So, during the course of this last year, we have acted on that. And so, what is different is, well, of course, Peter is here, that's one big difference. But aside from Peter, we have a much more commercially focused team in place.

10:55 Alongside Peter, we have Linda Sorensen on the Marine Marketing, and Matthew Hyde, who is a specialist in refinery economics. So those two individuals have really strengthened our capabilities across all the things we need to be able to do to be successful in this business, and particularly on supply and on refineries. And I know that Peter is going to say a few more words about this in the course of the presentation. But this business only works if we can match supply and demand. And in the past, we haven't been able to really devote the bandwidth to all that. Now we can. And now we're making some significant progress, which Peter will mention. And I think the other thing which you don't know, it doesn't come out in RNSs really, is the quality of the engagement that we have with our counterparties.

11:48 We're dealing now with more people, more senior people in a more engaged way than we've ever done before. And that's what gives us the confidence as a board to say, yeah, we're on the right track here. What we need is some more time. There's still no guarantees, to be absolutely clear. There are still risks in this business. But I figure that from my side and from the board's side, that we have the best possible chance to make this succeed. So that's what's different this time. We're ready to move forward. We don't want to stop doing what we're doing. We need keep pushing forward. Thanks, Andy. And this one is for yourself, Peter. What should shareholders expect to look out for in the near future? Well, that's really an easy question to answer. Two or three things. We need to get the agreements with MSC and Cargill agreed and signed so we can move on to execute the trials. And we need to mobilize.

12:48 The third one or second one, if you will, is really about refinery engagement. We need to continue the good work that Matthew has put in, in terms of understanding where the value is hidden and where the value is. We have signed NDAs with a number of refineries over the course of the last four, five months on the back of us understanding this better and also on the back of Embassy actually pushing this with certain refineries to help us in. So we need to make sure it's clear to the refineries where the benefits are to them and that there are benefits enough that they can share that with an end user such as MSC. So these are the things you got to look out for. That's what we wanna be measured on. We also have and this is secondary because these are the other ones that are leading to real cash flows.

13:38 I would also look out for whether we can get a trial finalized and up and running again with OCP and that that leads into another offtake agreement. It's gotta be on a smaller scale than than one with a large shipping company, but but I I I expect us to be able to finalize that engagement one way or the other as well, so so we know exactly where we're at. These are the three things. Thanks, Peter. So, Andy, can you explain why we're raising funds at this low price? Yeah. So I think the way that shareholders should consider this really is effectively a rights issue. Obviously, there are no actual rights there, but it's a righteous issue using modern techniques. It's a way in which shareholders can evaluate the company's progress and say do I want to help the company get to the next stage or not? It's an opportunity to invest.

14:34 Often rights issues in the past when they were done were done at low prices and it gives investors the choice. So it's a similar situation. However, we wanted to reserve as much as possible of the offer for retail investors and shareholders in general. But at the same time, we wanted to be sure that once we do it, we succeed. So we had to raise 1,200,000 to be able to show a clear twelve months working capital. And to do that, we needed to use brokers to do a placing. And the price that came out of that process was that we challenged and we could not get the book covered at a higher price. So, at the end of the day, it is better to do this at a penny than it is not. It's not what we desired, but it's better to do it than not.

15:31 We were oversubscribed at a penny, So we've cut back the placing in order to make sure that retail investors have got half of the amount, the total amount that we're looking for in order to play with and to top up their investment if they wish to do so. And as David will say later on, that 2,400,000 on current trajectory would get us to the point of commercial self sufficiency. Thanks, Andy. So this one was probably the most commonly asked question we've had, and it's why are the MSC agreements taking so long, and what are the remaining items to be finalized? Very good question. I've been asked that before. I think there's an element of underestimating the complexity of these contracts and of dealing with very large organizations.

16:19 Should we have known better? Perhaps. We also start off working on a reasonably modest budget. So having all the skills in the company is probably never gonna be defensible or realistic. I think we're learning from it. There's been an element of unrealistic expectations, that's for sure. I think we're now at a point where we're seeing that despite the difficult situation for particularly for the shipowner here in managing their fleet and protecting their seafarers, that we're seeing very good momentum in the replies we're getting and they're meaningful. I will also go as far as saying we're now down to some issues that where it's really about now we've to make a decision.

17:07 We feel that if we can't bridge it now that we have an alternative, we feel we have a little bit more agency now perhaps. And I know you're going to be saying thinking when when are we going to know? And and if it was up to me, we would know it within a couple of weeks, but it's not only up to me. So one thing is to get it agreed. Another one is to get it formalized, and and we will come out when we assure it's been formalized. I think some of it is also, and I don't want to make bad excuses, but clearly, it's been harder this spring to get things handled and addressed simply because of the situation in the Strait Of Hormuz and in the Persian Gulf.

17:54 I'm not saying it's easing up now, but I feel we're in a situation now where we're getting the replies we need. So I feel reasonably comfortable that this is something that we can have clarified quite soon. Thanks, Peter. So that's the end of the initial questions. So I think we can jump into the presentation now. Here we go. So a disclaimer, as always. Initially, an introduction of QUADRISE, I'm not going to go through all of it because you know and you can read it afterwards as well. But essentially, we have two products. We have a basic EMSAAR and the bio EMSAAR. They're promising to deliver lower cost and lower emission products for shipping, for refining and for industry.

18:41 We have chosen to focus on shipping upfront. I think one of the key features here is that it's low CapEx, so it's reasonably cheap to install. There's an existing distribution of the feedstocks that we need. We have a track record which precedes the company has real track record. I think what I also want to maybe highlight a little bit more is that we have been through a bit of a restructuring in 2025. Andy touched upon it as well in his opening remarks. But I feel that we have had a good look at the strategy, which is basically good, but we tried to narrow it a little bit so we are focusing on fewer things upfront and then doing more of them if we can. You've So heard me before speak about addressing other owners that we could potentially make trials with. We spent a lot of time on that as well. It's a long process.

19:39 But also, we've added to the team. We changed the team. So we now have Matt in as a refinery economist, so we are making sure that we can actually scale up production once we are in the middle of or ready after the trial with MSC. And I think that's very important. So that's sort of introducing it very short. And the next one, a significant opportunity, it's a big market. It's a 6,000,000 barrels a day market. 6% of that is oil used by shipping, 40% by heavy industry and power plants. So it's a very attractive market to play in. The question is why should customers look at QUADRISE? Why is it attractive?

20:25 I think there's an increased focus on fuel security, on cost control related to it, but also really how how much longer can you stretch the existing fuel supplies. So the fact that we, under current circumstances, can stretch the fuel by up to 9%, I think, is a real strong selling point. The fact that it leads into potentially the same platform reducing emissions, think, is an added one. And right now, the regulatory drivers are not as visible as they were two or three years ago, but they're still there. We still have fuel EU and a number of countries who still want to go ahead with something like fuel EU if the IMO regulation doesn't come into place soon enough. It's low CapEx. It doesn't cost much to install on the ship, and there are different ways we can go. I'll come into what it means also for refining.

21:15 There's a slide there with me on that. The inside advantages, just recapping them fairly quickly. It's about improving margins. We believe that MSI can be sold at a 10% discount to the end user, to the ship owner or ship operator. But there's also real upside for a refinery. And some of the work that Matt has helped us do in terms of analyzing a select number of refineries all have their own equipment, their own fuel streams, etcetera, so they will be different. But a medium sized refinery producing some 12,000 barrels per day of HFO will be able to improve their margins by $15,000,000 to $25,000,000 per year by producing MSAAR. And that is achieved by reducing the cutter stock, so reducing the usage of diesel and jet fuel that can then be sold to other clients, so reducing the need for that in the production of the heavy fuel oil for shipping.

22:19 It also provides some optionality for these refineries. So there is value being left on the table, we believe, at the moment. Here we go. On the Biofuel platform, obviously, this one was particularly important to be prepared for the IMO regulation, but also fuel EU. We believe that the bio EMSAAR platform as it is right now is future ready, so we can meet the requirements of fuel EU as it is quite a few years forward. As you also will know, we have a technology fund where a number of companies are providing different feedstocks on the biocide, from Licella to Alder to others. Karkyl is our partner, as you know, on the glycerin for the MCS or MSC trial.

23:14 So we have a good selection of different technologies that are in different stages of readiness for the biofuel solution. Recapping our markets, we look at them as four different ones. There's a marine market, an industrial market, there's a refinery supply market and there's an upstream one, which is really about the heavy oil, that would be Valcor, for example. These require different selling efforts, slightly different selling points. They all have different reasons why they are on our list, different attractions. Our decision has been to focus on the marine market simply to make sure that our with a modest organization and also with the skills that we have now acquired in the company that we focus on a segment where we have the best chances of building a foothold and generating cash flow so we can look at where would we want to go next. But we need strategy is really about not just what we have chosen to do, but also the things that we will not do now. It doesn't include it for the future, but we just need to focus so we get to cash flows as fast as possible.

24:22 We have a number of commercial projects. I'll go into them following this. Marine is MSG Cargill right now. We've had plenty of discussions with other shipowners. I'm happy to answer questions on that too. And in the industry, it's very much OCP right now. There are a couple of other projects popping, including Sparkle Power in Panama. On the refinery side, really, really important for our production. Upstream is Falco right now. So if we look at the product one, we've already touched a little bit on where we're at with MSG and Cargill. Really, this is important for us. It's not just about the trial, although that is important, but it's also about getting to a point where there's an offtake agreement.

25:08 And the moment we have an anchor client in major ports, we also have a production. And once we have the production, we know there are other players out there who will want to go in and try it out. And I've said this before, so please pardon me if you've heard it too many times before, ship owners are notoriously conservative and they all profess to loving technology. They will love it so much that they don't want to get into it first, they will leave it to others. And then once it's proven, they will come back in. So we can expect that there is a tail here where once it's up and running and once, for example, the MSC is using it, others will come in. So this cannot be overstated how important it is. So it has our complete attention to get it up and running. One thing that might be worthwhile adding here is that for OCP, this may be less about just cost saving.

25:57 It's also about the fact that 30% of their volume is being sold into the EU, and they're increasingly feeling the, the pressure from the EU on having low emissions on products being imported into the EU. So this is important for them to meet the emissions test as well. So that might give a bit of encouragement to speed it up. So we still don't have it signed, but we have very meaningful and constructive discussions with the right people. Sparkle, we've reported on that. The big outstanding here really is to get the feedstock to do this. We have the letter of intent that will expire by the end of the year, at least in its current form, but we don't have the feedstock.

26:42 We're very mindful that Venezuela is changing. Of course, a major, major setback with the traumatic and unfortunate earthquake some weeks back. But it would be a natural source of feedstock for us. So we're watching that carefully. We don't really have an alternative right now. Although ones that we can look to, we are servicing through agents of ours in South America. But it's this one is all dependent on getting the feedstock. Velchol, their latent payment, we have $950,000 outstanding. We haven't shipped them equipment, by the way. We had a discussion with them as late as late last week, last Friday sorry, on Monday this week, where they're reaffirming their willingness to pay, expecting to be in production in August, September, at which time they will they promise to pay us.

27:44 They have now finally managed to assemble a full sample for us. So we are awaiting that now. So it should be shipped momentarily is what we are reliably informed. Here we are. So the year has really been about sharpening our focus. You will remember I spoke about having more parallel projects. Well, at the same time, we're also sharpening the focus. So it's really about shipping. It's really about MSC now. And it's really also about the refinery engagement, which would be so important for our scaling up and for us getting to actually issuing invoices. We have spoken to a number of ship owners when we're talking about parallel trials, for example.

28:30 And we've been quite mindful of selecting ones that tend to have a preference for technology that has been interested in reducing emissions. And some of the challenges we are facing is actually that there is significant interest in our product also because it's easily adaptable, really. But some of the challenges are the classical ones in shipping that you may own your ship, but it may be in a pool, in which case you're rewarded on pool points, and and therefore not being paid for the fuel burn, but only for the capability of the ship. So there are lot of these little things in shipping that we need to to bridge, so it takes time. We're talking to the right people. We're talking to the technical departments, occasionally to procurement part departments, OEC departments.

29:16 We have access to senior management in all of these places. It just takes time. So for now, our focus is on finalizing the MSC trial while we're trying to sort of keep the bottle boiling on the best of the candidates on the other shipping companies. We do believe we have a strong platform for growth. We remain committed to protecting our IP portfolio. They're being reassessed and reviewed every year by competent London based IP. I think what's new and what's really important here is also we have a beginning execution capability, not just bandwidth, but the right people to meet the two major challenges that I have described. So getting the MSC trial up and running, getting it signed, but also getting the refineries ready to look at this to show them where the money is, so we have the ability to build our production in the maritime hubs that MSC would need if they were to adapt this as a fuel of the future.

30:29 David, I'll pass this one over to you. Thanks, Peter. So we set out initially to raise up to 2,400,000 as part of this process by replacing subscription and retail offer. We've already secured 1,200,000 of that, and that will allow us to progress operations through to the end of June twenty twenty seven. That will supplement our existing funds, which were approximately 2,200,000, towards the end of June. That will allow us the platform to progress trials with Valkor, with with OCP, and to start the MSC trial and get that up and running. We'll also be be able to progress our refinery engagement to secure the feedstock supply agreements that we need, and this money also helps us strengthen our balance sheet to support counterparty confidence as well.

31:19 Now why we're talking to you today is we are seeking an additional 1,200,000 on top of that. What that will do if we unlock that whole 1,200,000, it will allow us to progress based on our projections through to being a self sustaining company. So what we see is the current financial year that we've just started is about the trials. Commercial supply will start the following financial year, so 2027, 2028. And as you can see there, our projections model positive cash contributions from projects. Then after that year, we'll then be in the sort of self sustaining positive cash flow territory. As well as that, we'll also be able to progress our business development pipeline, so discussions with additional shipping companies, etcetera, progress the r and d activity, progressing towards BioAMSOL zero, and also additional digitalization initiatives as well.

32:17 So that's everything on the fundraise. So I'll just get back to you, Peter, Thanks, Evan. So the investment case here is really about we're in a market with very strong drivers from regulation but also from the need to reduce costs on fuel. We're seeing amongst the people we're talking to in shipping that the main driver right now is probably the momentum is shifting a little bit towards MSAA simply because of the fuel savings that are inherent in the technology and in its promise. It can be scaled up reasonably quickly. I believe we now have a well defined strategy for the coming year, a very narrow focus on the business case, on the deliverables, and I believe we have the team to do it. So that is the investment case.

33:19 Thank you. I think we will now move to questions from before the presentation. Yeah. We have we have a selection of presubmitted questions, which I'll address. Some of these were asked a number of times. And then following that, if there's time, we can go on to some of the the questions that have come in live during the meeting. Mhmm. So if we just start with the questions on MSC, I think the most important one, are MSC waiting on refinery progress before signing? That's an easy one to answer, no. We had discussion just as I decided on whether we could scale up. I think that has been answered also with our refinery engagement, our hiring of Mats, the cases we build up around a number of refineries, the fact that MSC has helped us get in with at least one of these refineries.

34:09 So so I absolutely don't think that's the case. Quite on the contrary, I feel we have a reasonably strong case. Of course, you know, some of the refineries that we had wanted to talk to are in the Persian Gulf. So there's a bit on a standstill right now, but but refineries and and key shipping hubs are sharing data data on their fuel streams as well. So, no, that's not the case. Thanks. And with regard to the equipment that we're gonna be using for the trial, when are we gonna be moving that to Antwerp, and can we move it before we've got the agreement signed? Conceivably, we could, but that would incur unnecessary expense. Remember, there's also a time required on MSC side to mobilize the MSC LANDRA. So so it would be incurring extra expense for very little extra benefit, but we have applied for the branch license.

35:02 We are in touch with the Dutch sorry, the Belgian authorities on on all the things that has to be improved. The the ISSC license that we that is required to produce and sell fuel in the EU is is in the hands of Cargill and will be extended to our blending operation in Antwerp. So all the things that we can conceivably do beforehand without incurring costs at with no reward, we've done. Thanks. And can you tell us anything about progress with other shipping companies, including potentially Maersk? Yeah. So we have we we we've tried to pick I mean, there are lot of there there's a number of ship owners that have invested in different green tech solutions over the last couple of years through their family offices, sometimes directly from the company.

35:51 Some of them have a lot of processes going on, not all of them relating to fuel. We tried to pick the ones that are actually interested in this area and has made investments. But we're also looking for companies that has nimble organizations, that has strong or big fuel need. And we've had we probably whittled that down to five or six companies that we have meaningful discussions with. And as is the case in many of these discussions, you get in the technical department, you talk to senior management, you talk to the ESG team, and and then there's an impasse while they're while they're thinking about it. Very often, what we hear back is that, they all get it. They they like it. Now they just have to convince, chartering guys, the commercial people, that they need it instead of just paying the fines. Right? So there's a process going on also in many of these companies.

36:46 So I'm not precluding that any of this will happen. I don't have anything that is just ready to sign. But I see it as an effort that even if it doesn't lead to another trial, it's part of our sales effort to the right people. The smart the ones that are smart and on on on sort of the front foot in terms of the technology we wanna sell. Yeah. Thanks, Peter. Can you explain who we have at QUADRISE with marine engineering experience? Yeah. We have we have we have a gentleman in at QF who has a background as a chief engineer who's been sailing and who has that experience. We have access to chief engineers who's been helping us train as well because we are very mindful. But this is another issue. It's a little bit beyond what we are setting out as a challenge now, right? But we are mindful, of course, that there's an even bigger challenge once we succeed with MSC.

37:43 Because coming to a ship that we haven't been on before with a crew that we haven't met, We're gonna be, you know, the famous seagull coming out from head office. That's never popular. So we gotta make sure that we speak the language of the chief engineer and also the crew on that. Fortunately, we have a lot of experience. So we spent some of the the spring examining, you know, the the Maersk ship, some of the other installations we've been involved in to make sure that we captured what we have learned, so we have a proper checklist of what we need to do in advance. And a lot of that is about how do you communicate with the ship and taking ownership of that. Thanks. I'm going to come on to some questions on Morocco now. Can you elaborate on the involvement of the OEM now following the change in location of the proposed trial?

38:34 The OEM, to the best of my knowledge, has not been involved yet. So the focus now is on identifying where is the biggest potential for OCP, on one hand, to meet the requirements of reducing emissions, EU, as I mentioned in my earlier remarks, but also on the cost side. And then the OEM will be involved there. But I don't have a proper update on that right now. Thanks. And then just on to VAALCORE now. Where are we in relation to fuel consumer identification for MSR with Valcor? In in it's it's it's very much in their court now, but we are trying to help them on the side. We have also through shareholders, by the way, we have a couple of contacts that we think could be interesting and could be interested.

39:31 So we're trying to create a connection there. They are also canvassing at the moment locally and regionally to find clients for it. Okay. Thanks. We had quite a lot of questions on the refinery side of things. So can you tell us any more about the four refineries mentioned in the RNS? Where they are? How are the discussions? And when can we expect announceable progress? So we trying to have something to talk about, right? So that's one of the reasons why Matt is so valuable for us that his analysis and his and the analysis is not just how would it look today at prevailing prices. It's looking at at at the price range for the last ten years and then looking at how would the outcome be for a given refinery set up in a certain way, those pricing conditions.

40:26 So we don't we're trying to get to a point where we and we have that with a number of them, where they're actually sharing their own data with us on on how they are set up and how they're calibrated. And that, of course, makes it more much more realistic. But having those conversations means that we are sort of in house, if you will. And that's very, very valuable for us because it becomes relevant and pertinent. Then they need to decide which of the projects they're going ahead with. And we just gotta remember, we are we are a small company. We're now talking about a fundraise, securing us one year ahead. But for a refinery, it's a generational investment before they take something in. So we need to be able to convince them that this is not just a one year project, but it's something that they will be happy with also in five or in ten years. And we think the numbers justify that, but these are the discussions we're having. And the fact that we now have proper analysis that gives real insight helps us to get in.

41:23 Timeline, I can't say well, what I can say is that once we get in, there's also a trial period there, right, which is probably six to nine months, at least at the refineries we've been talking to so far, in our best assessment. So that just highlights why it's so important for us to get started on this. Because if we are running a trial, you know, that's gonna be you know, where we the time horizon is more or less the same. We have to start now if we wanna be ready with the production at the end of that. Okay. Thank you. Just summing up on Panama, is it possible to give some sort of timeline? Are we talking weeks, months, or years to monetize this opportunity? I I simply can say. I I think I I think the the fact that it's all about the the the feature I mean, the supply of of residues in in a region where that's pretty challenging means that we are I simply can't say it. There's not a good answer to that.

42:24 There's not an honest answer to that. I don't Andy, if you want to come in there. You've been you know the region very well and you've been a little bit involved. No, I think the answer you give is absolutely right. I think the earthquake in Venezuela is disappointing, but I think that the slight opening of Venezuela is potentially significant for us. As many of you all know, the company began its history in Venezuela with ore emulsion. It's absolutely the case that the crude oil there and the residues there are particularly well suited to our process. So, if we can unlock that, then I think it's very promising. At this stage, the earthquake, it's hardly enough even to get a phone call going with them, let alone organizing that. But I think it is a positive development.

43:20 But in the short term, we don't have an answer to the supply for Panama. And that's what's what's holding us back and giving and it's the reason why Peter's giving the answer he he is. Thanks. I'm just sticking with you, Andy. One question on financing. When do we expect to ask investors for further financial support? Yeah, so this is a very much a leading question. And I'm not sure I'm not surprised people are asking it. And I think the straightforward answer is 1,200,000 that we've already got takes us the middle of next year, 2,400,000 if we get the full subscription of the retail offer takes us to sustainability, all being well with the projects.

44:06 And so I think there is also from a board point of view, you've got to look at it and say, well, why are we a listed company? Well, it's in order to be able to grow. And so, we shouldn't exclude the possibility that actually we can surprise to the upside and that we have reasons to scale up the business. So, I think that for me to stand here or sit here and say we're never ever going to raise money would be doing a disservice to that really. Think if we feel the need to raise money to grab an opportunity, scale to increase the scale of the business, address some of the challenges of scale that we have, then we should look at that. Will it come up? Who knows?

44:52 But as a board, we do look further ahead as well, as well as trying to make sure that we've got the tools we need for management to take the business forward over the planning period. Thanks, Andy. I suppose that leads into the next question, which which I'll take myself. What non dilutive funding options are currently under consideration, and what conditions need to be in place for these to become realistically implementable? So what we're looking for here is project level financing. So we'd be able to also look at asset financing as well. So strategic partnerships, joint ventures, grant funding as well. And in order to access that sort of funding, we'd be looking for commercial traction. So if you've got a commercial contract in place, these sort of finances would be a lot easier to secure, and it would mean we'd be able to bring money into the business without diluting shareholders down further.

45:51 The last question I'll take on the on the pre submitted questions, it's just about the the communication side of things. We had a a number of comments on this. So can we not have a business update every couple of months being honest about what has been done and what needs to be done on all projects to get the commercialization? Is it which one? Sorry. I I was I was addressing that, Andy. Yeah. So I think that we don't want to commit ourselves to a specific regular update because we may not have the news flow that we want in that timeframe. We do already do the twice a year for the results in the interims.

46:41 And we would like to have much more frequent news flow than we've had in the past. We do have projects to, if you like, modernize our news flow. We've taken on a new director, Michael Covington, recently, who's very active in this area. I think that we may see some improvements and changes in our communication style that will make us a bit more, if you might, a bit more alive to the market, if you like, and a bit more communicative. But we need to take the RNS tool seriously. And when we have news that we need to RNS, we will our approach rather than committing to every two months saying whether to say something whether we got it or not is to actually hit some milestones and tell you we've done it.

47:37 Thanks, Andy. Do we have time for one more question? So one of the questions that's repeated a few times here on the on the ones that are coming in now is, did MSC request that we raise sufficient funds for the next twelve months before we make progress? That sounds a lot, Peter. We have had no such request from many of our counterparties. Mhmm. So so so for us, it's about assessing what we need to remain credible to refineries and to also to ship owners. Right? So so so we don't we don't wanna run out of of breathing space, so to speak. Okay. Thank you. Another one of the questions. What will happen if you don't achieve the 1,200,000 in the retail offer?

48:25 So we've already secured 1,200,000 through the through the placing. Whatever we get in the retail offer, we'll supplement that. If we get 2.4, that's projected to take us through to being a self sustainable, positive cash flow generating company. Anywhere midway in between that, we are gonna have to assess that when we get the final result, and we we'll assess things at that point, but we can't say it now. I think that probably takes us to the end. So thank you very much indeed for your presentation. Peter, if I may just come to you just for some closing comments. Yeah. I just want to thank you all for joining in. I I I apologize for the technical challenges, but I hope it made sense. I hope you had your answers your questions answered. Obviously, some of the written ones have not been covered in full, but you will get the written replies afterwards.

49:14 Always feel free to write to us and ask questions. We are happy to answer and happy to to try to clarify. So with that, thank you so much for listening in.