Afcons Infrastructure (NSE:AFCONS) Q1 2027 Earnings Call

0:01 Ladies and gentlemen, good day, and welcome to the Afcons Infrastructure Q1 FY 'twenty seven Earnings Conference Call hosted by DAM Capital Advisors Limited. As a reminder, all participant lines will be in the listen only mode, and there will be an opportunity for you to ask questions after presentation concludes. Please note that this conference is being recorded. I now hand the conference over to Mr. Krishan Mundra from DAM Capital Advisors Limited. Thank you, and over to you, sir. Thank you, Nishiya. Good morning, everyone, and a warm welcome to the Q1 FY 'twenty seven earnings call of Afcons Infrastructure.

0:48 So to discuss the results, today, we have the management with us, which is represented by Mr. Subramaniam Krishnamurti, the Executive Chairman Mr. Srinivasan Paramasivan, the Managing Director Mr. Ramesh Kumar Cha, the CFO Mr. Hites Singh, the Head of Corporate Strategy. Now at this point, I'll hand over the floor to the management for the initial remarks and post which we can open the floor for the question and answer session. With that, over to you, sir. Thank you, Krishan. Good morning, ladies and gentlemen. I'm Krishan Murthy Sudhramaniam. It's a pleasure to connect with our investors, analysts, stakeholders as we begin the new financial year. Thank you for joining us today and for your continued support and interest in Afcons Infrastructure Limited.

1:35 Our financial results and investor presentation for the quarter have been uploaded on the stock exchanges, and I trust you have had the opportunity to review. Joining me today are Paramashivanshi, Universal Managing Director Ramesh Kumar Jaw, Chief CFO and Mr. Hite, Singh Head of Corporate Strategy. Let me begin with an overview of our financial performance for the quarter. Afcons reported a total income of INR 2,727 crores in Q1 FY seven compared to INR 3,419 crores in Q1 FY 'twenty six. EBITDA for the quarter stood at INR $2.60 crores with an EBITDA margin of 9.6%. Profit after tax was INR 30 crores. While our financial performance for this quarter was lower than the corresponding period last year, as several of the challenges we encountered during FY 'twenty six continued into the first quarter of FY 'twenty seven.

2:25 In addition, adverse weather conditions affected the progress on certain marine projects, while land handover at a few project sites advanced more slowly than anticipated. Execution of some fast track projects also progressed at normal pace due to labor shortages, while a few other projects were impacted by pending clearances. We expect these issues to gradually ease, enabling stronger execution momentum over the coming quarters. During the quarter, we achieved an important milestone. I'm delighted to share that the Mumbai Puna Infrastructure Missing Link project was inaugurated on 05/01/2026, marking yet another defining milestones in Afcon's journey of delivering iconic infrastructures for the nation. The cable safe bridge executed by Afcon stand as the centerpiece of this landmark project.

3:13 Standing as India's tallest road cable safe bridge, it's not merely a bridge, but a reflection of Indian engineering capability, determination and execution excellence under some of the most challenging conditions. We are proud that the Mumbai Kunai Xrosphere Missing Link project is yet another example of many complex and technology challenging infrastructure projects that Afcons has successfully executed over the decades. As we look ahead, we are equally encouraged by the quality of our existing order book, which includes several projects that have the potential to become engineering landmarks in their own right. This reinforces our confidence in the long term strength of our project portfolio and our ability to continue delivering world class infrastructure.

4:00 Alongside engineering excellence, our commitment to safety remains unwavering. Safety is a deeply embedded aspect in our culture and continues to be recognized by leading global and domestic institutions. During the quarter, several of our projects with the British Safety Council's International Safety Awards with distinction. These recognitions are meaningful because they validate the high standards of safety, discipline and operational excellence that we strive to uphold across every Indian project, Afcons Project. Let me now briefly touch upon broader infrastructure environment. For some time now, geopolitical developments have weighed on infrastructure investments and project award activity across several regions. We remain hopeful that as the geopolitical uncertainties across key regions begin to ease, infrastructure investment and project award activity will gradually regain momentum globally as well as in India.

4:57 Against this backdrop, we continue to pursue opportunities that align with our well established risk management framework across our core markets in Asia, Africa, Middle East and neighboring geographies. Our approach remains selective and disciplined with a clear focus on sustainable and profitable growth. As we move through FY 'twenty seven, our priorities remain clear. We will continue to focus on growing order book, improving collections, strengthening cash flows and further enhancing and strengthening the balance sheet. These initiatives will provide stronger foundation for our growth and long term value creation. With that now, I invite our Managing Director, Paramashivansiniwazan to share his remarks on the business outlook and operating performance. Thank you, gentlemen.

5:48 Thank you, Mr. Subramanian, and good morning, everyone. I extend a warm welcome to all our investors, analysts and participants joining us today. We sincerely appreciate your continued confidence in Afcons and value the engagement you bring to this discussion. As Mr. Subramanian highlighted, the first quarter of twenty seven continued to be impacted by some of the factors that affected us during the previous financial year, along with certain execution delays across a few projects due to factors beyond our control. Liquidity conditions remained tight and collections continued to be moderate during the quarter. We remain actively engaged with our clients at multiple levels to accelerate recoveries and improve cash flows over the coming months.

6:43 Coming to profitability. We reported an EBITDA margin of 9.6% during the quarter. The moderation in profitability was primarily due to lower revenues during the quarter. As turnover improves across projects, we expect profitability to correspondingly improve over the coming quarters. On the operations front, I am pleased to share that both tunnel boring missions for our Mumbai Ahmedabad high speed rail C2 package successfully commenced their initial tunneling drives as per schedule. This marks an important milestone for the project, particularly considering the challenges it has encountered over the past year. Having achieved this milestone as planned, we expect the projects to move into its next phase of execution with the TPM main trailing drives expected to start in the coming months.

7:35 Coming to order book, I am pleased to share that we have begun financial year '27 on a positive note with a healthy order inflows of INR 13,219 crores during the first quarter. With these orders, our order book stood at INR 43,290 crores at the end of the quarter, providing strong visibility for future revenues. As on date, our orders booked for the year stands at 15,700 crores, including orders received up to date. With this, there is no order pending to be converted from L1 to that of an order. The healthy order book positions us well for sustained growth over the medium term.

8:20 As these projects progressively move into the main execution phases, we expect improved operational momentum and a gradual strengthening of our financial performance. It is equally encouraging that these orders wins are significant achievements in their own right. The Croatia Railway project represents the largest single order ever secured by Afcons. While the Vadwan Port project provides us with the opportunity to construct the world's second largest breakwater. These order wins reflect our strategic intent of focusing on large value complex jobs without compromising on our risk framework. While this is encouraging, we remain equally focused on securing new orders and further strengthening our order book over the year. Our teams continue to actively pursue opportunities across both domestic and international projects markets, and we remain confident of achieving our full year order inflow guidance of INR 30,000 crores.

9:22 This is supported by our healthy bid pipeline of approximately INR 1.5 lakh crores for the remaining nine months of financial twenty seven and INR 3.96 lakh crores for the next two years across transportation, marine, hydro, underground, water, urban infrastructure and industrial infrastructure segments. The pipeline is well diversified across segments and geographies and consists of projects that align well with our technical strengths and disciplined risk management framework. To conclude, while some of the challenges that affected Finance Year twenty six have continued into the first quarter of the current year, we remain encouraged by the conversion of key orders and opportunities ahead. We begin this year with a healthy order book, a robust bid pipeline and a team that has repeatedly demonstrated its ability to deliver complex engineering projects under challenging conditions.

10:15 As execution across our existing projects gathers pace and recently secured orders moved into their main construction phases, we expect a gradual improvement in performance over the coming quarters. We remain committed to disciplined execution, prudent risk management and operational excellence while continuing to pursue opportunities that align with our long term strategy. With our strong technical capabilities, diversified presence and proven track record, we remain confident in our ability to navigate the current environment and create sustainable long term value for all our stakeholders. Thank you once again for your continued trust and support. I now hand over the call to our Chief Financial Officer, Mr. Ramesh Jha, to take you through the financial performance in greater detail.

11:10 Thank you, sir. Good morning, everyone. Before talking on the numbers, let me reiterate that company is into business of construction. The margin in a quarter varies based on the nature, type and quantum of work executed. So quarterly results may vary in different quarter and may not be indicative of the annual result or trend. Now coming specific on the numbers. In this quarter, we have done INR 2,727 crores of total income, which includes other income of INR 56 crores. This is 20.3% down from the previous year, wherein we had done INR 3,419 crores of turnover. This number was also inclusive of the other income.

11:58 Q1 execution is on the expected line. As in many projects, there were lack of work front availability. And generally, Q1 remains a little bit slow in terms of collection because of most of our customers being government entity disbursed the annual budget by March and then devote Q1 in planning and budgeting for the next financial year. If we talk from the specific experience of financial year 2026, 'twenty seven, Q1, then we would feel liquidity across market needs significant improvement. Payment related issues in UP Jaljivan Mission is still continuing. We have received small amount of payment based on the completed portion of work. Also, we have noticed that across the spectrum payments are being stretched for some or the other reason. Hence, we are not maintaining hence, we are maintaining the balance between execution and liquidity.

12:49 In FY 'twenty seven, we have booked order amounting to INR 15,695 crores till now, taking the pending order book in excess of INR 45,000 crores. In FY 2027, we are targeting to significantly improve the order booking and improve the balance sheet by collecting some of the stock receivables. Uncertainty around the economic activity because of what geopolitical and related stuff continues. So it doesn't make sense for any guidance in terms of growth. In terms of EBITDA for the quarter, we have done INR $2.63 crores, which is 9.6%. This number has also come down by 41%. We had done INR $4.45 crores of absolute number EBITDA, which was 13% in the previous year quarter one.

13:41 In our EBITDA calculation, we consider DG commission as part of our operating expenditure. So EBITDA, what we are talking about is after removal of DG commission as an operating expenditure. And this also includes the other income as part of revenue. We have explained earlier also that arbitration interest, foreign currency exchange gain and miscellaneous income are recurring and very integral to our business. Hence, these are factored as other operating income. So for the Q1 period, around INR 57 crores is other operating income, which we have factored in EBITDA calculation. In terms of profit before tax for this period, we have done INR 51 crores of profit, which is significantly down. We had done INR 183 crores of profit before tax in the previous year Q1.

14:35 And profit after tax is INR 30 crore, which is also significantly down because we had done 137 crores of profit after tax in the previous year quarter one. Profits got impacted because of lower turnover on the overall basis. Margins in the individual progress, the projects continues to be robust, but because of lower turnover overall, they could not generate sufficient overall contribution to cover the overhead costs and still have sufficient profit what the company has traditionally been doing. We have put a lot of efforts towards reducing costs on the possible revenue, but that has been partially offset by increase in energy, transport and logistic costs. Talking about the finance costs. In Q1, we have seen higher average borrowing during the quarter.

15:24 Because of this, interest cost has gone up. Coupled with this, new interest bearing advances received during last, say, twelve to fifteen months has elevated the interest cost on client advances, taking the overall interest cost up. Currently, 62% of our advances are interest free and 38% of the advances are interest bearing. This year, we have booked substantial orders, but the corresponding advances have still not come into the company. A large part of this is from the current orders we have backed is from international market, which is interest free. And also the orders what we have received in domestic market, the interest rates are quite low. So we expect the interest cost to go down in the coming quarter.

16:11 In terms of EBITDA, the depreciation is at 83.52 crores, which is 3.06% of the turnover. This quarter, the TBM operations were virtually not there. So the accelerated depreciation, what we charge was not there in the quarter. In terms of tax, the rate is quite high. If we see the PBT vis a vis profit after tax, the tax rate is working out almost 40%. This is primarily because on Afcons profit, what we are paying the Afcons stand alone profit, what we are paying, 25% tax. However, in consolidated profit, this has decreased due to some of the closed projects, which is in JVs and subsidiary, where minor administrative expenses and provisions leading to small losses.

16:59 This has got amplified in this quarter because of lower profit in Afcon. As a result, the tax charge represent a higher percent. Also, few JVs pay tax rate in the range 35% to thirty six percent second in some of the overseas locations like Bangladesh, tax is charged on turnover. In such situation, if you don't make profit above the threshold, your tax deduction needs to be charged off. So because Afcons profit was lower, some of the other entities, the administrative expenses leading to lower profitability in those entities, the overall tax rate has gone up. In terms of ROCE and ROE, we'll talk about talk in on the annual number only because it doesn't make sense at this point in time.

17:48 Specific on the net working capital, the net working capital is at an elevated level because of funding to the projects and no material movement in collection of the blocked up asset. We are witnessing delays in certification of the work done and release of payment in projects. This has led to increase in uncertified work done, leading to jump in working capital requirement. Generally, this trend remains in Q1, but we were expecting some improvement in this quarter, but the collections have not moved to a level where we would have expected. Our management is rigorously working towards cash collection, and we are confident to turn things around this year. In terms of debt, in Q1, payment issue has continued and operations have been we had to fund the operations.

18:37 Also, we have done sizable CapEx payment this quarter. So debt has moved to a higher number. On a net debt basis, the debt to equity is around 0.68x of the network. On behalf of Afcons, I thank everyone for attending this call. Now I request the moderator to open the floor for question and answer. Thank you. Thank you very much. We will now begin the question and answer Anyone who wishes to ask a question may press star and one on the touch tone telephone. If you wish to remove yourself from the question queue, you may press star and 2. Participants are requested to use handsets while asking a question. The first question is from the line of Aditya Bhartia from Investec.

19:32 Go ahead. Hi, sir. In the opening remarks, we spoke about some of the execution challenges getting addressed over the next couple of quarters. Just wanted to check, are we seeing some concrete evidence of that? Are we seeing execution pace picking up across multiple projects? Or at this stage, it is a bit of a hope? At this stage, we are definitely seeing the symptoms of it's all happening. And some of the issues with respect to land related issues are getting addressed by proactive activities undertaken by Maharashtra government.

20:18 So that would result in significant release of plans, whichever places are there, there have been regular reviews from the government, which helps in pushing the project ahead. In there are similarly in Madhya Pradesh, where we have a project also where there is a compensation related issue is getting resolved shortly, movement has happened. So there also out of two projects, one project will start moving up immediately. That is what we look. Therefore, the execution related challenges with respect to blocked up things is more or less getting over. And with geopolitical issues is becoming a little improved as compared to the last quarter, I would put it things in terms of movement of materials, though it's a little expensive as compared to the earlier period, it would still be improved in terms of movement of materials for our overseas projects.

21:12 And with these two, we do expect there are clear indications that things are moving towards positivity. Q3 and Q4, we believe, would see significant uptick. Perfect. Perfect. That's great to hear, sir. So my next question is on some of the large projects that we are having, like the Croatia project, the Vadawan project. For these two projects, when should we expect work to start? And is it that the initial part would be more about designing and to that extent, there'll be lesser revenue accretion and only over a period of time, these projects should be picking up pace? If you could kind of indicate us the the execution time lines around that.

21:58 And the related question is on the HSR project. How should we think about that in terms of receiving receiving payments in respect of past work that is done and execution phase from here on? Thank you so much. With respect to Croatia, we believe the current year there will be a miniscule expenditure and next financial year onwards, Croatia will pick up. With respect to Vagwan project, the alternative methods are being discussed with the client. And currently, the approach road and also the reclamation related work is yet to be completed. And you would have read in the newspaper about the education and all around that.

22:45 So we are working with the client proactively with the thing. But current year, it will only be a geotechnical investigation and related design related work and initial installations. That will only happen in Badwan. All others, there are also aggressive push from the government also to see that certain facilities or certain approaches are handed over to us so that we can start the work. So therefore, in both the projects effectively, current year, there will be minuscule turnover. With respect to HSR, whatever turnover we have done, all these have been paid for regularly. And the tunneling related turnover will commence from November technically.

23:31 There are till that time, the initial drive will happen for about three months. And after that, we do expect a good turnover As we had conveyed earlier also, tunneling carries higher level of turnover. So therefore, as we start tunneling deeper, we'll get into the turnover properly. We are in the final stages of getting the settlement with respect to force majeure done. And most likely, it will get settled in the current quarter. Perfect. That's great to hear. Thank you so much. Thanks, Haridya. Thank you. The next question is from the line of Shrivan Shah from Dollet Capital. Sir, a couple of questions. So I was listening your opening comments and reply to the first participant questions.

24:35 So broadly, how so let me break it into two, three parts. So do we see Q2 revenue be a Q o Q flat or lower? And then when we are saying the H2 would be a better execution, I understand though we are not providing the full year guidance on the execution front. But on on a directional front, even if we, let's say, assume a 20% kind of a growth, is it possible or not? Even if that is possible, then for full year, the broad rough, my calculation says, we will be a kind of a flattish or maybe a 1% kind of a growth. That's the correct way to look at, or we can see maybe a 5% plus kind of a degrowth for this year?

25:31 So see, we have already talked about that at this point in time, it doesn't make any sense to give any direction on the top line or any profitability related guidance. So we are not commenting on the Q2, how it is going to pan out or how the year is going to pan out. But as things stand, things are moving in our whatever expectations we have. And we aspire that we should build a very strong order book in this financial year, and we should also improve the balance sheet this year by way of collecting, by way of reducing our contract assets and receivable and by reducing our debt. So we should be in a very strong position by end of the year in terms of order booking, in terms of financial health, and then we should ramp up the progress in the year financial year 'twenty eight.

26:32 Yes. So I understand, but still again happening on the same thing because a directional... Because when we are saying that in h two, we should see a a a a strong execution. So Oh, so how strong... So so, mister, my point my my point, sir... Listen to me, sir. My point is that because if we will be doing a kind of a flat because that's what the broad, even if I take a 20% kind of a growth in the second half and maybe a flat in the Q two, That means this will be the fourth year where we will be kind of having a flat revenue from the... What we have done in the in the FY '23. From there till now, we will be having a kind of a flat growth. So that's the... And at the same time at the flat level, we will be drawing or declining.

27:25 So will FY '28 then would be... Or maybe '28 and the '29 would be a so strong, maybe a kind of a 25, 3030% kind of a growth that we are looking at? That's the direction I wanted to understand. So just to answer you, in past, if we see the performance of the company in generally, the Q1 is around, say, 40%, 45% and Q2 remains to be around H1 remains to be around 40%, 45% and H2 remains around 55% to 60%. Directionally, if you ask me, we are looking at a similar kind of a situation this year also. Q3, Q4 is going to be where we'll bounce back to the levels we were generating earlier.

28:12 And in terms of as the order booking is ramping up and the way we are targeting to reach in terms of financial health, we are looking at a strong FY 'twenty eight and FY 'twenty nine. Okay. Great. Sir, is it possible to share a couple of balance sheet data points because when we are saying... We have mentioned that the... I think the date would have also increased. So if you can specify the... Particularly the gross date and then the cash level and also the... Some of the inventory trade data absolute numbers and maybe mobilization advance, returns and unbilled. So that will help us to understand how the things are either worsening or maybe at similar level.

29:02 So that would be helpful. See, generally, the balance sheet numbers are disclosed in H1. So maybe in September, we'll be coming out with the detailed numbers. So you'll be able to figure out. But in terms of Q1 number, generally, we have seen almost, say, last ten, fifteen years, we have seen that Q1 numbers are will be always lower than the number of annual number, March number. So this is the trend. But in terms of absolute debt number, we have talked about that the debt to equity is around point six eight on net debt to equity basis. And numbers have slightly gone down as compared to the March number. But the way deterioration happened in terms of, say, receivables or debt number or, say, contract assets number in last year Q1, this year it has not gone that bad.

30:04 But sir, unless we give the some directional numbers would be difficult to to to kind of quantify what we are saying. So at least a gross date level, what's the gross date number and working capital days, what was in FY 'twenty six and now how much increase has happened? At least... It is at a elevated level as compared to a March number. But since we have the auditors have not certified the balance sheet number, it will not be prudent on our part to give those numbers. Yes. Because all other companies also provide, I understand it is an unaudited number, but at least to to to to get us get us sense and how one can pencil in the numbers.

30:56 Unless we have any any... Anything on that front would be... It becomes a very, very difficult to to kind of a pencil in how one can can look at the the full year and maybe the next year. So political sorry for that, diplomatic answer would be difficult to kind of convert into the numbers. So that's my suggestion. Thanks. You will be able to calculate these numbers. You look at the March debt number, you look at the March network number. And what we are saying that at this point in time, the debt to equity on a net debt basis is around 0.66. So you'll be able to calculate it. It's very simple. I'm not spelling out because those numbers have not been audited. So it is not advisable that we talk about on a public forum these numbers.

31:44 That is very easily calculate. But working capital days, sir, we are not saying anything directionally also with how much ten, twenty days increase, something, It has marginally increased from the March number. Okay. Thank you, sir. Thank you. Thank you. The next question is from the line of Balasubramaniam from Arihant Capital. Sir, our execution strategy to prioritize liquidity over maximizing quarterly revenue, basically limiting executional projects with elongated payments.

32:36 At the same time, we are focusing on reducing the net debt by this financial via contract asset liquidation. So like how you are managing this duality, whether slowing down new work to protect cash flow while simultaneously executing existing work to unlock cash? Or how you are because our order is also more than INR 13,000 crore in this quarter. So I'm trying to understand on the execution side, how we are prioritizing our existing work as well as new work? So you are right that it's a very difficult situation where we need to manage the execution as well as we need to manage liquidity, and we are not unduly overexposing ourselves with some of the customers.

33:25 So this approach, we are not approaching with all the customers. There are certain customers where we had seen that there were some challenges in those projects. And in those projects only, we are taking such kind of stand like, say, projects in Bangladesh or some water related projects. We are giving funds to the project based on the collection that project is generating. Otherwise, in excluding these projects, the payments are forthcoming, the projects cash flows are positive. So such projects we are supporting with wherever there is a temporary mismatch and if there is any requirement for the completion of the project. Sir. Okay. Sir, our strategic equipment base is nearly 4,300 crores, I think, which creates high depreciations as well as maintenance burden.

34:18 If you look at last few years, our top links anywhere between INR 10,000 to INR 13,000 crore range. But if you look at our interest cost and depreciation, it's substantially increased. Is there any thought process or tool strategic shifting towards asset light model where you can like lease personalized equipments or to form a JV with equipment providers for some specific mega projects. So that way we can improve our OE and ROC profiles. So what's your thought process on owning most of the equipments as well as moving towards leasing or renting the equipments? For strategic equipments only, we keep investing.

35:06 We don't invest in all the equipments, number one. Number two, as we had explained in the cost also, in outside of India, especially in Africa and all, the cost of rentals are very high. The equipment value is sought to be realized in nine months' time in Africa as opposed to some forty eight to sixty months in India. Therefore, in some of those cases also, we do invest equipments on the higher side and we get commensurate returns as well. Third, in marine, we hold strategic advantage by having a large fleet of equipments.

35:56 And that is something which helps us in some of backing of marine projects and other thing. And only thing as last couple of years, our turnover has stagnated or slightly regrown. It creates an impression that it is on the higher side. It is not so. As we move forward, you will find that we have asset turnover ratio also significantly improved. So we have not invested in any assets, which is not of strategic importance. Thank you. The next question is from the line of Abhinav from ICICI Securities.

36:47 Please go ahead. Yes. So thanks for the opportunity. My question is first on the pipeline. You mentioned about INR 1,500,000,000 for the next nine months. Can you break that across the segments? Sure. For the nine months out of this INR 1.5 lakh crores, major chunk is from urban infrastructure, which for us comprises of metro and elevated bridges and elevated roads, that is around 34%. Marine is 32%. Hydro and underground is 20%. It includes our water business as well. Surface, which is road and railway business, that is 14%. And this pipeline is for the next nine months.

37:34 Understood. And sir, any color on the long term pipeline you mentioned about INR 3,900,000,000,000? Sure. So on the long term pipeline, as MD has mentioned in his speech, our long term pipeline is close to INR 4 lakh crores. In this part also, the pipeline is evenly distributed. Around 36 is from the urban infrastructure space. And surface transport will be around 20%. The hydro business is relatively less, it's around 15% and remainder will be Marine and Industrial. Understood. Sir, can you give some details on the urban project, are the big ticket projects that are coming in the near term?

38:23 Some of the big ticket projects if we can talk about this Brahmaputra Tunnel is something which is coming up, which is around INR 19,000 crores. And there is Dulera connectivity in Ahmedabad, which is about INR 18,000 crores. And many other projects of the sizes elevated expressways and other things are coming in excess of all around INR 4,000 to 5,000 crores. There are a number of bridges which are coming up, which is also in the region of between INR 3,000 crores to 5,000 crores. So we have a strong pipeline in the domestic market. And similarly in the international market also there's quite a good pipeline available to us. Understood. So my last question is on the depreciation of TBM.

39:11 How will that be accounted for? So TBM, we are accounting for as per the company's act prescribed rate. And we'll continue to account for those depreciations. Understood. Thank you, sir. Thank you. Thank you. The next question is from the line of Parish Kazi from Group. Please go ahead. Yes. Hi. Good afternoon. Thanks for taking my question. So a couple of questions from my side. First, what was the CapEx that we undertook in Q1? CapEx. So CapEx in Q1, we have done close to INR 150 crores capitalized, but then there is a sizable amount in CWIP.

40:08 Possible to quantify that or let me see him as more or less same as what it was at the end of March, almost I think we had almost crores of CWIP, if I'm correct. Yes, similar number is there. Got it. The order intake front, we already have one about INR 15 odd 1,000 this year. So for the year as a whole, fair to say somewhere around INR 30 odd 1,000 is something that we can look at? Yes, INR 30,000 crore, we are very confident of booking at the minimum. Sure. And last question to Ramesh. Our other income, I mean, like you mentioned about INR 57 odd crore. This year now, I assume, for exchange, etcetera, everything is included in that.

41:02 For the year as a whole, what kind of number that could be? Because I mean, it has come down to you, so I've almost about four fifty, four seventy odd growth of ForEx gain earlier. Now it's reduced. So what number could it be? So what number you are talking about in other income around INR $4.50 crores, $4.70 crores. It used to be a combination of these factors like, say, arbitration interest, foreign currency gain and the miscellaneous income and some of the other stuffs also like insurance claim and other stuff. Now for this quarter, the number is low because we also try to close things in March wherever possible, and the activity also goes up in H2.

41:49 So this year also, we'll be in the range of, say, for the year, somewhere around 400 or so. Sure. Thanks and all the best. Thank you. Thank you. You. The next question is from the line of Aditya Banerjee from Nomura. Please go ahead. Yes. Hi. Thanks for the opportunity. So just on the order input front, because we've already, you know, recorded such in the order include, what is the upside risk that will overshoot the 30,000 order into target by '27? I would say that first, let us achieve the INR 30,000 crores, then we will see what is the upside we are in a position to make it.

42:45 And currently, we are at INR 16,000 crores, and we hope as we proceed, we will be in a position to guide you better and today's guidance is INR30000 crores. Understood, sir. And another question that I had was the overseas projects that we are undertaking for cooking creation or... So between the domestic project and overseas projects, which is likely to have a better, you know, margin profile? I'm... I understand that it's different than the bidding and etcetera. But, typically, what's the margin differential between overseas and domestic projects, if you could give a sense on that? So in overseas projects, we generally make better margin. And the margin, the delta in, say, domestic versus overseas is around 200 to 300 basis points, which is higher in overseas market.

43:42 And whatever project we are targeting in overseas market, The margins specific margin, we'll not be able to give you what margin we generally target. But then domestic market, whether it's overseas market, the margins are better in the overseas market. Understood, Mr. Sridhar. Those are my two questions. Thanks for the opportunity and all the best in the coming quarter. Thank you. Thank you. The next question is from the line of Vishal Periwal from PL Capital. Please go ahead. Yes, sir. Thanks for the opportunity. Sir, in terms of our profit and loss account, what could be the reason for decline in the depreciation?

44:27 Any link within the revenue that we book or how is the reason behind that? No, sir. Depreciation, there is no link to the revenue because generally, depreciation is a time related cost. So the number has come down because as I explained in the opening commentary, in this period, we did not had too much of tunneling related activity. And we have explained in past that we used to do accelerated depreciation on the tunnel boring machine. This is the running meters it used to excavate. So this period, hardly there was any TBM related tunneling activity. That is why the number has come down. No. So which means it is linked with the revenue, right?

45:16 It is linked with the revenue only to the extent of PBM, which was not there in this quarter. Okay. Okay. Fine. And second thing is, like, in terms of execution, you did clarify in previous questions. But if one has to pinpoint, like, there is our order book is relatively young initial stage, and execution could pick up as the quarter progresses, And that is one thought. Another is probably, like, you know, there are the delays in the payment from the client. And as the clients are delaying, they're not able to pull the money or probably, like, you know, deploy the money back in the working capital and and and other things, which could improve execution. So how which one directionally you will pinpoint, I mean, like the reason of muted execution?

46:04 See, as we explained that the order book, whatever we have booked till now, say, around INR 16,000 crores of order. These orders to convert in revenue, it will take some time. And the order what we were having in hand on, say, around INR 32,000 crores. In such projects, there were a couple of projects, which were moving slow. And then in some of the other projects, there were some land acquisition related issues or there were some change in scope related stuff. So the work fronts were not available. Because of that, there was a muted revenue in this quarter. As things stand, we expect the execution significantly pick up from Q3 onwards. And so we'll have a very strong H2.

46:56 And all these orders, whatever we have booked and the balance period in this year, whatever orders we are going to book, we'll have a very sizable order booking in our hand matured for construction for the next financial year, FY 'twenty eight. So that's where we are looking at that FY 'twenty eight, we'll have a sizable ramp up in terms of execution. Okay. Sure, sir. And thanks for the answers, and I'll come back in the queue, sir. Thank you. Thank you. The next question is from the line of Rahul Gupta from Anand Rathi Share and Stockbrokers Limited. Please go ahead. Hello sir. Sir, my question is regarding the cash flow from operation. Is it negative for this quarter also?

47:44 No, I didn't get the question. What is that? Sir, cash flow from operation, is it negative for this quarter also? Yes. So cash flow from operations generally in Q1 remains to be negative because in past also we have explained that customers what they try to do is they will try to release all the payment in up to date payment in March quarter. And Q1, they devote their time for planning and budgeting for the next financial year. So there is less activity in Q1 from the customer and payment also remains to be slow in Q1. Cash flow is negative. Okay, Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. The next question is from the line of Bharat Shah from Nvexa Capital LLP.

48:34 Please go ahead. Yes. Hi, sir. So my question is regarding our JGM order book and receivables. Can you quantify the amount of the order spending in order book and how much receivables we are still yet to receive? So in Jaljiv and Missan, all put together, we have got INR $12.21 crores of total order, in which from the UP, the balance order is INR $5.10 crore. Madhya Pradesh is INR $4.14 crore and Rajasthan is INR $2.97 crore. Among this, in Madhya Pradesh, we are not having any major problem because whatever work we are executing, we are getting paid.

49:20 And in Rajasthan also, payments are partly coming. Major problem is in UP, where the payments recent time, they have started making payment because wherever we have completed the last mile connectivity, the payments have started flowing in. But then it is not that significant corresponding to the receivable we have. So in past also, we have explained that in UP, we were having close to 400 crores of receivable. From there, we have received a very small fraction. So for all practical purposes, the receivable remains to be in the similar level. Understood, sir. And what will be the unbilled amount, sir? So this amount, what we are talking about is a combination of receivable plus unbilled.

50:08 Understood, sir. Thank you. Thank you. The next question is from the line of Ashok Shah from A. Clairvaya Invesco Family Office. Please go ahead. Thanks for taking my question. Sir, we have very good order book for you, sir. But over the last few years, we are facing a exhibition problem or some some different type of problem, maybe land and everything different. So what's the problem or how we are managing or going to increase the turnover or existing level? For what percentage of the sizable order is not slow moving? Can you explain why percentage?

50:59 See, we have explained in the last quarter earnings call on some of the issues, which has been factored in. If you look at of the overall order book value, roughly around 5.65% is lower category. And Bangladesh orders constitute about 2% and another about 3% constitutes Jaljivan Mission orders. So these three put together roughly around 11% is what we can categorize or either slow moving or otherwise. In some of the other cases, as we had explained, there have been initial right of way and related issues, which is getting resolved.

51:47 That is why we are saying that third and fourth quarter, it will pick up better. And with the proactive involvement of government of Maharashtra and there have been a lot of improvements in such areas, which in the past had contributed a bit. Now with the proactive involvement, things are getting resolved and projects will be available for execution. And the other ways we have already started in the water portion and other things. Land portion also, we will commence in the second half of the year. So with that, things will improve. So these are the when nearly about 11% of the orders are slow moving or other things. And another about roughly about 20% of the orders are in the initial phase.

52:34 Then that is where there are challenges in terms of converting it into turnover, which will start improving in the second half year. As stated in the call, sir, we do plan to reduce our debt debt over the years by the March. So what is the size we are seeing to reduce our debt? Yes. So debt, we will look at a sizable reduction. And this year, as we said that we had to make payment for some of the capital equipment we have bought. Despite all that, we see that we'll see some we'll see improvement. The number what we have clocked in FY 'twenty six from that number, we will see some improvement. At least there will be some 5% to 10% improvement from that number.

53:30 From the $45 Yes, we are looking at debt closing, say, around INR 3,500 or so. So it will be reduced by how much as a consolidated level by around INR 300 crores to 400 crores? No. So what we are talking about from FY 'twenty six, that number, we are looking at a similar number. But then this year, we will be making payment close to, say, around 700 crores to INR 800 crores towards CapEx. Despite that, we will see improve we'll clock the similar number on the debt front. In terms of working capital, the similar amount of improvement will be there. So this INR 700,000,000 INR 7 yes.

54:19 So what I was trying to explain that the debt number in absolute terms will be similar number what we have clocked in March 26. But since we have done, we'll be doing a sizable CapEx this year. In working capital, we will see the improvement. So that's where I was saying that we'll see around 5% to 10% improvement in working capital, that is bare minimum. So net debt will be reduced by INR 700 crore or it will be lower than that? Net debt will be reduced net debt will be somewhere around, say 2,700 crores, INR 2,800 crores kind of a number. Thank you sir. Thank you and best wishes for current year. Thank you.

55:06 Thank you. The next question is from the line of Adhikra Banerjee from Nomura. Please go ahead. Yeah. Hi. Thanks for the opportunity for the follow-up question. So just one understanding I wanted to have. So regarding this JV losses and higher taxes that you were mentioning about, So how are they accounted in the payment statement? Just wanted an understanding on that. So you are asking about JV accounting or you are asking about the JV tax? So tax basically, so why the tax went up this year or this quarter? So just wanted to understand where that part is accounted in the P and L statement? So it goes as a tax in whatever the JV pays tax that goes as a tax in the respective entity. And then in consolidation, that forms part of tax.

55:58 Because most of these JVs are forming part of the stand alone financial itself. So it gets incorporated in stand alone financials as well. Now specifically, I was trying to explain for this quarter because in Afcons, the profitability was low. In terms of percentage, it is appearing to be around, say, 40%. But the amount, if you see per se is not that big number. It is around, say, $4.05 crore. Had we had maybe, say, INR 150 crores, 200 crores kind of a profit in Afcons, what we were clocking for so many quarters, this INR 4 crore will not make that tax percentage a big number. Okay. But in that case, your tax would have also gone up, right? Like this wouldn't tax number, right, this court code that you're saying, that would have also gone up in that case. So just wanted a bit more clarity on that.

56:52 No. So see, in Afcons, we are making so most of the entities, we are making tax payments in the range of 25% or so. Just because that this quarter, in some of the entity, some of the closed project entity, we had to incur some administrative costs because in such entities, we are following up with customers for collections and some other closer aspects are not closed. And in such entities, we are required to make ECL provision on the receivables. Because of that, we are looking at in those entities, we are looking at a loss kind of a situation because the projects are completed. So all these administrative expenses, ECL provisions are coming as a only cost. And because of that, the consolidated profitability is coming down.

57:39 And this whatever loss we are incurring in these entities, because of that, the tax rate is going up despite paying, say, 25%, 26% tax only. Got it. Got it. That's great. Thanks. Thanks for answering the question. Thank you. Thank A reminder to all the participants to press star and one to ask a question. The next question is from the line of from Dollet Capital. Please go ahead. Oh, hi, sir. Thank you for the opportunity again. Sir, for CapEx, you said in this quarter, we have done INR 150 crore CapEx.

58:25 But on the cash flow front, this number must be on the higher side? Yes. Because some of the amount, which was on March 31, which was on in CWIP for that, we had to make payment in the quarter. Okay. But for full year FY 'twenty seven, we are looking at INR 700 crores, INR 800 crores CapEx? Yes. And for next year, given till now, whatever the orders that we have bagged, what broader number one can look at in terms of the CapEx for FY 'twenty eight? So in FY 2028, we are looking at CapEx in the range of INR $606.50 crores.

59:13 Okay, okay. And given the depreciation, I just said maybe the from November when the TBM full flares, we will start. So even in Q2, the similar kind of INR $83.85 crores kind of a depreciation should be there and for full year, how much one can look at in terms of the lower depreciation versus FY 'twenty six? No, you have rightly picked it up. As the TBM related activity starts, there will be a corresponding depreciation coming into play because the TBMs are in the initial drive and it is still sitting in the CWIP. And once it gets capitalized, then the corresponding depreciation will start coming in.

59:58 So it will in H2, there'll be a higher depreciation definitely vis a vis this number what we are looking at in Q1. But then correspondingly, revenue will go up and it will get it is fully factored in all our calculations what we look at. And it will reflect accordingly. So but whatever way, even if you look at the full year depreciation definitely would be lower versus FY '26 of INR $4.54 crore Because even if we take up 83 crore this quarter and the next quarter also similar number, $1.60, and then even if fixed up to $1.30 odd crore.

1:00:44 Then also this number, is it fair to say or should be close to INR 400 odd crore or even less than that? See, we'll not be able to give you that number, but then maybe for all practical purposes, you can consider FY 'twenty six depreciation number. Okay. Okay. And for finance costs, this quarter and the ECL provision, so was there any ECL provision in this quarter? And on the finance cost, how one can look at the finance cost? So as far as ECL provisioning is concerned, we have explained last time that we have made a framework for ECL provisioning and which was approved by the Board and which was we had taken professional guidance from experts in this particular field. And this is that framework was devised.

1:01:46 And this is that framework we have started making provisioning from last year, and we continue to do the provisioning on that basis. No specific provision as such in any project because we believe that any such eventuality I mean, we don't foresee any such eventuality going forward. And whatever project specific provisioning we had to do last time on a I mean, company basis, if we evaluate, let's say, last twenty, twenty five years, maybe those were aberrations because such instance, we never had. It was maybe, say, at max, I can say, 1%, 2% kind of possibility.

1:02:31 So we don't foresee going forward such kind of provisioning will be required. But then on a prudent basis, we have made a very robust provisioning mechanism and taking guidance from professors and basis that we have been making provision. As far as finance cost is concerned, as we said that the dates are higher than what was in the March. And in terms of client advances, the interest bearing advances continues to be on the similar level what we were having for the last three, four quarters, similar numbers. So the finance costs are also on the similar line. In terms of average borrowing costs, if you ask me, we have brought it down. We have significantly brought it down. Many high cost debts, we have replaced with low cost debt.

1:03:18 So from operational aspects, whatever control on things we have, we have done our bit, and that's where despite debt going up, the finance cost has not significantly gone up. But once we see improvement in collection and all, we'll see a marked reduction in the finance cost. Okay. Okay. And lastly, in Q1 revenue, can you break it down into domestic and international, what would be the share? See, in terms of revenue from overseas market, as in March, we had shown that the overseas revenue had come down to around 13%.

1:04:03 So in Q1, we are having overseas revenue around 16% from overseas market. Domestic is 84%. But now the order mix is changing. At the moment, the order book, what we have, we have moved back to around, say, 25% from overseas market, and there are a lot of other projects in overseas market we are expecting. So we hope that we'll go back to 30% from overseas market, that is for minimum. And then as if the order book moves 30% from overseas market, revenue also will go back to 30% from the overseas market. Okay. And balance, whatever we are looking at close to INR 14,015 thousand crore kind of order inflow, there also one can say sizable should be from the international side overseas. Yes. Yes. Okay. Thank you and all the best, sir.

1:04:51 Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. As there are no further questions from the participants, I now hand the conference over to management for closing comments. Thank you very much. Thanks for your continued support, and we look forward to an exciting period ahead. Thank you all. On behalf of TAM Capital Advisors Limited, that concludes this conference. Thank you for joining us, and you may now disconnect your lines.